But other classes have either more cc, more mobility, more defensives, or more dmg with mortal strike taken in account (10-30% mêle dmg not showing on logs) in account than paladin to compensate. That’s why pally has been bad for a long time now in terms of bringing something another melee doesn’t do better already.
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they want to see more 11+ necrotic wakes with triple pally no healer druid tank runs
You said it felt smaller then melee. So to you, ypu would have to be inside the mobs hitbox to use it standing on top of the mob. Like what?
Does wake feel small too?
Correcting ppl isn’t trolling.
Is this really worth argueing for?
I am trying to prevent confusion here. Not spread it with your “feelings”. Truth don’t care about feelings.
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Seal of the Crusader heals for every target CSAA hits. The healing is actually really good, but only for Ret and only with CSAA (TS is actually looking somewhat attractive to me with the loss of 10% CDR on our generators).
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Looks like this might need to be looked into. Otherwise CSAA will over take TS as a need rather then an option.
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Yeah but if this thing actually heals THAT GOOD for only csaa with Blessed Champion, it may be worth keeping despite the Haste nerf we received. And this is coming from a Templar Strikes fan here.
This, on the real. And I LOVE my Templar Strikes combo.
Damn! Damn! Damn!
(Slightly off topic: This is why I love reading these forums, you tend to learn a lot. I had no idea Seal of the Crusader now heals us since the tooltip states “Heals a nearby ally.” Well done, you two)
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Even before this last patch if I noticed the healer down, I would go back and help them up, at the cost of some of my overall DPS for the fight.
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4% loss doesnt make csaa suddenly unviable nor does th 10% cdr on general make ts more viable. yall forgetting that radiant glory allows us upward of 60% of two charges of how which should be your rotational filler.
this is why i dislike TS cause theres no spot to put it without bumping off a charge of boj and pushing judgement down on the priority system as filler along with how
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Or just don’t take 2 charge boj and get the 2 hp per use instead.
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even with 2hopo boj its still clunky af
also why would yo uwant to actively get rid of something that makes you waste less art of war procs due to its charge mechanic. thats like designwise, dumb.
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Unless your slow, that rarely happens.
The meager little passive healing talents are all garbage and not worth taking. The improvements to blessings and personal cooldowns are great though.
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That’s generally out of the player’s control with only one charge of BoJ.
-If you have one charge of BoJ and its halfway through its cooldown when you get an AoW proc then you have only gained half a charge, and you are wasting its CD until you can work it back in to the rotation.
-If you have two charges of BoJ with one charge on CD and the other halfway through its CD when you get an AoW proc you get the entire depleted bottom charge refunded with the other still halfway through. You have the duration of that half charge to work the AoW proc into your rotation before you’ve wasted anything.
I’ve mentioned in another thread that I like the idea of a Templar Strikes build (especially with the Herald tree), but the opportunity costs involved in using it mean that it is unlikely to ever be optimal. AoW resets are one of those opportunity costs.
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I accidentally went into a Stonevault 11 with Templar Strikes and I was not pleased. Crusader Strike as an active ability makes the rotation feel less streamlined. You can’t go from 5 holy power —> TV —> another TV like you can with CSAA working its magic in the background. Crusade sometimes takes longer to power up. You don’t get Empyrean Power procs during cooldowns because TS is not a priority.
TS doesn’t add anything new or interesting: BoJ generates one holy power and applies a DoT, except it does it at range and with a unique animation. Wake of Ashes —> Hammer of Light does the whole one ability changing into another shtick.
If we want to add a little more complexity to the rotation, Hammer of Wrath needs a more prominent role. There’s so much wrong with it I don’t where to start.
The best way to fix this is to:
- Delete Crusading Strikes.
- Make BoJ baseline give 2 HP, so with the 2x charge talent it becomes what it was originally in Beta for DF or was it SL… can’t remember.
- Vanguard’s Momentum makes HoW hit 4 extra targets for 80% of its damage
- Using HoW makes the next finisher deal 30% more damage
Benefits:
- HP is easier to come by without relying on Crusading Strikes
- HP also comes at a more expected pace and you can actually have a muscle memory with how much HP you have without looking at your autoattack timer/bar
- More variation with TS in our rotation and using it once to start its cd between keeping up BoJ Expurg and adding Judgements along with anything else, is a sign that you’re paying attention to the priority system, then using it within 5 seconds for the 2nd attack
- HoW is useful in AOE and actually used
- HoW becomes a priority over the other generators due to its finisher increasing power
But that’s just my opinion.
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At the same time though, for the cost of losing that “cd time” your getting 2 hp, which in my opinion evens it out a bit.
Just an opinion though, everyone has their own playstyle of course.
So make HoW into a judgement?
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Well, I think the rotation feels better with CSAA than Templar Strikes for the reasons I listed. As for HoW, yea, it might be a good idea to add it to Blessed Champion or something like that, but then also having it increase your next finisher’s damage just turns it into Judgment, doesn’t it? Well, maybe that’s okay.
I think what should be done is this:
- Add HoW to Blessed Champion.
- Have it apply the Judgment debuff.
- Wings no longer makes it available. Instead it’s an execute that becomes available when the target is below 35%. (I know we lose some cool factor here but I don’t think HoW will hit hard so long as it’s tied to Wings.)
- Consolidate the HoW procs. Ret currently has the Final Verdict proc and a proc in each hero tree. One way to do this is to replace Vengeful Wrath in the class tree with a proc that Ret talents / hero trees talents can plug into and build upon. (Bake Vengeful Wrath into baseline HoW.)
- Make sure HoW deals enough damage that it’s high priority whenever it’s available.
So HoW would basically be a better version of Judgment that pushes Judgment down in the priority list when it’s available. This isn’t be super complex, but it’s better than what we have now. HoW shouldn’t be filler.
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Given how similar they are, I don’t know why we wouldn’t go further and make it so that Judgement changes to HoW on enemies below 35% health or something.
That would free some space to re-introduce CS in the rotation.
Or it becomes an effect
Hammer of Wrath is now a talent that states : Judgement now deals X (double?) additional damage on enemies lower than 35% and FV/DS hit 20% stronger on enemies lower than 35% (because they are both hammers to 
)
something like that, you spread the execute effect on some other abilities as well to accentuate their importance.
OR it could replace FV to!
If it’s supposed to be this big execute ST finisher, why not embrace this and make it giga strong as a spender?
Just spitting ideas in the universe 
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Turning Judgment into HoW wouldn’t really work because of how much Holy and Prot relies on those buttons being seperate.
Buuut… there is no reason why a Ret spec tree talent couldn’t do the job. Blizzard did briefly try during the Ret rework. It didn’t work back then because the foundation had not been laid down for the new spec.
But what if we delete Divine Arbiter and have a talent in it’s place that merges Judgment and HoW? Then there would actually be room for Templar Strikes, which in turn would lead to the Holystrike and Radiant builds having different playstyles.
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Humm you…
Make AS give HP again for prot!
And… for holy… you give judgement 2hp? ( I don’t play holy much, does it already does that?)
As far as I’m concerned DA and SL can be changed to something else, they aren’t particularly interesting, they do the job, that’s it.
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