Yes it does come at a drastic cost already, it should provide a dramatic gain, which it doesn’t.
That gets fixed in later expansions because it’s a major design flaw.
later expansions make hybrids OP and are garbage 
Honestly for any idea of changing Classic, I would absolutely want it kept minimal. I’ve been Ret since 2006, and I don’t want Ret to be a top end DPS spec. I’m happy with upper-middle. Completely. I think the simplest, smallest change that would get the most mileage is the SoD version of Crusader strike.
- No mana cost, generates mana
- Short CD
- Mild damage
It’s small, it helps the mana problem, it adds some damage but not too much. It doesn’t make Ret some kind of PVP god. Couple it with the SoD bubble nerf (-50% damage instead of cutting attack speed in half) and voila. Honestly that would probably be enough to make Ret functional, with gear issues that Tier represents corrected. They can keep the same tier set bonuses we have now, just put spec-proper stat variations on em.
The real hot button nobody wants to hear: Warrior is OP for raid DPS. They are, period. We all know it, or they wouldn’t be the meta. But I don’t think they need massive, sweeping alterations to nerf them. Numbers tuning only to reign them in some.
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So if you nerf warriors, rogues become the new meta stack. What then?
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They’ll just complain until Rogue are nerfed. I’ve said it four different times now. Holy Paladin is far more desired than a dime a dozen DPS, they are necessary and bring the buffs that a ret does. So if a mandatory role brings what a mid tier dps brings, why would a raid waste a top tier dps slot on something that brings damage but not top damage? They’d have to buff ret to the point they deal top damage because if they don’t, they bring nothing valuable to the group as ther class utility is already provided by healers that are a necessity.
I mean, they already added Dual Spec and have made other changes.
I think giving Paladin a taunt and Druid a rez wouldn’t be the end of the world.
Just my opinion.
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Rogues do a lot, but they don’t truthfully do enough that bringing warriors down to where rogue is now would make people stack rogue. Hell, don’t even have to bring them all the way down to rogue. I’m talking small numbers tweaks just so they aren’t overwhelmingly astoundingly better than everyone else.
Don’t need nearly as many healers as you need DPS, and sometimes a mediocre class in the hands of a good player is preferable to the best class in the hands of someone who licks the windows. A LOT of people who choose the hyper meta class fall into that window licking category. Doesn’t matter that the class is top, they struggle to break into the middle with it.
The majority of raids aren’t the meta composition. Because the playerbase doesn’t balance out that way. Warrior can keep the top spot for all I care, I just think they should be less far ahead of everyone else.
That still won’t change anything. Warriors dealing more damage than rogue by even a margin won’t change the warrior stack because 1. They are still better. 2. They are so stupidly abundant they can afford to stack so many of them. They’d just take an extra rogue over anything else. Back in the day, this was a non-issue as everyone and their mother didn’t believe in the min/max cancer and played to have fun so we had more class variety.
Oh true. I agree the playerbase itself is the problem, we push these metas unfortunately. I do maintain that if more stuff was at least functional, and the gap was smaller, it would at least be LESS of a problem.
I don’t think this is a problem that can be completely solved. But I think it can be mitigated, with SMALL changes. It doesn’t have to be grand and sweeping.
Define small. Because as long as hybrids don’t deal warrior damage and their utility and buffs are brought by an in demand spec with healers you aren’t being taken with “minor” tweaks. As i said in my other post, if the utility is all covered you only have one option left to you, damage. And why would a group waste a slot on a no utility, mid tier damage spec when you can take a full fledged, top damage dealing class of which we have 3 and all are heavily saturated?
I mean, you say that but I raided, as ret, in 06 and again through all of Classic. People DO do these things already. Making them suck less just makes it more common and acceptable.
You need other healers besides holy pallies. You do. Which means if you want all the pally buffs you can’t JUST bring holy pallies. I already said, it’s REALLY common for people to not be able to get decent warriors because so many are about as useful a square wheel. The good ones also tend not to like sitting in a stack of other warriors and competing for gear, so they’ll leave to try to find a raid where there’s less warriors, or the warriors are already geared so they compete less. Happened a LOT in 2019/20.
As I said, not every raid is meta-optimal in composition. Other than a flat “no changes” mindset, what does it hurt to allow the floor to be less far behind, and the ceiling less far ahead?
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You have plenty of room in a raid my guy to take more than one holy Paladin. I’m one of three in my guild and we clear Naxx weekly, groups don’t need a ret for the buffs, we’ve got it covered. And let’s be real, if the community wasn’t meta driven you’d be in raids and not here begging for buffs, which unless you get a massive warrior, rogue, or mage boost and a massive nerf of holy Paladin to where you’d only ever want one of them in the raid you still aren’t being taken.
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Blizzard could make meme specs do the same damage, they could make all dps specs to the same exact damage without changing anything about the game, (Just adjust the numbers until they balanced) if they have anybody that is good at math.
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I’ve also answered this logic before. You could give every class 1 key that heals them to full and deals exactly 100k damage each button press and this new age meta slave playerbase would still look for players who push the 1 key faster than you do. And for some crazy reason players will still be upset and get angry by the segregation.
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Oh I’m not playing Fresh at all. I’ve already done it twice. 
I have no dog in this fight. It sounds to me like your motive is you don’t want your holy replaced by a different spec paladin. Which is an ok perspective to have, it is.
I’m only here pointing out possibilities that AREN’T SoD. I always dreamed of a Vanilla experience that had some SEMBLANCE of balance. I have no desire to go back for a third helping of the same toxic atmosphere.
They aren’t going to replace me because I’m an in demand spec, and you’re some dime a dozen dps of which we have plenty. I chose to be useful. I have absolutely zero to fear losing my raid slot regardless of what they do with you.
Hybrids are supposed to be bad. Classic isnt about balance. Retail isnt either tbh.
Okay but what do you even tweak to bring them down? You can’t nerf their abilities, arms already struggles outside of group play and warrior on the whole sucks at leveling.
Honestly I agree with this, classic isn’t about balance, in the sense of rebalancing.
Hybrid viability outside of healing gets addressed in TBC, which the anniversary realms are moving into.
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