That is solely based on preference. You have six expansions each with its own version of range SV. Then you have two expansions with melee SV, so pick your poison.
If you have not seem from BfA raiding range is always preferred over melee. Then there was that Hunters were brought in to handle the “b*tch work”, like the belts in SoO, cause we could dps and move.
Low number of melee SV raiders just means groups are picking other specs that are better able to handle mechanics.
What I see is an overly large majority are BM hunters, which would mean most hunters then play BM, and thus MM and SV are both low in popularity. Can not just base a population by what you have seen, you need a sample size then from that small amount you will need to have at lease estimate of the sub count of WoW, and from that you could make a rough estimate of melee SV players.
However, since Blizzard has and will not give sub numbers the exact amount can only be guessed. Using WoWGraphs may not be accurate, but it about as close as I seen.
Nostalgia, everyone sees the past through rose colored glasses, while forgetting the struggles they had to get through.
The class I am posting on is irrelevant to the discussion and just an attempt by you to invalidate your opponent arguments.
Secondly Rogues as far as I know never had a history of being Range. So that goal post move was a reached. Hunters from their inception had melee options at their disposal. All they did was took that and expanded on it for survival.
Feral and Enhancement are specs that share a class with a ranged spec. Neither are as negatively affected as SV.
I see many times more MM Hunters than SV Hunters. I did disclaim what I posted with “anecdotal”, so you’re preaching to the choir. The point is there is no reason to believe the low representation in raids is reversed out in the world.
People are seeing the class on Classic right now, though. I think it’s more out of spite for BFA. BFA was a downgrade in general so it feels dirty saying that it did something better than a previous era of WoW, especially Classic, so people don’t admit it does anything better. Somehow spending 30-60 minutes on random low-droprate quests is twisted into a good thing just to spite modern WoW. I just played to level 10 on the stress test and all my stances to me are confirmed.
That’s still not explaining why this issue is uniquely bad for SV. BM has those pet interactions and it’s fine. The pet moves fast and both Kill Command and Barbed Shot cause the pet to charge to the target.
So is this how you usually argue? Strawmanning your opponent and just doubling down when being called out on it? It’s incredibly petty and dishonest. Cut it out. To me it is very clear you lack a good response to my argument so you are just pretending I said something different.
I’m not saying your argument is invalid because you are posting from a Rogue. I am saying your argument is invalid because classes like Mage, Warlock, and Rogue are counter-examples. You keep acting like Hunters simply cannot have three ranged specs otherwise they would infringe on eachothers’ toolkits and identities, yet we have other pure DPS classes that are either all ranged or all melee. If they can do it, Hunters can too. Enough with the double-standards. I pointed out you were posting from one of these classes just to make you aware that the answer is right in front of you. If you were posting from a Warrior I would still bring up Rogues, especially since their 3 specs are far more similar to one-another than MAges or Warlocks, and arguably even moreso than pre-Legion Hunters.
What does that have to do with anything? I’m not saying Rogues should have a ranged spec. In fact, I believe the opposite: it’s fine for Rogues to have their current model with 3 melee specs and it should stay that way. The difference between you and me here is I believe that standard applies to Hunters too while you hold a different standard for Hunters; you believe that Hunters are required to have more spec distinction than Rogues, otherwise you would be saying the same thing about Rogues as you do concerning Hunters.
We didn’t have melee “options”. We were literally required to use melee attacks when close up to the enemy. It wasn’t a strength, it was a weakness. Losing those melee spells was not a loss. It made the class stronger. Not just literally, but in identity, too. We finally were true masters of ranged weapons and could adapt and use them in any environment, which is quintessential to the Hunter identity.
Someone around here posted the original WoW manual description and it’s worth repeating, because even with that melee restriction the manual makes it clear that ranged weapons come first and foremost in the class. “The hunter is a unique class in World of Warcraft because it is primarily a ranged attacker”. They didn’t just “expand melee for SV” (nice reductionism). They removed the single most important thing that defines the class and made the spec exclusively melee, something that NEVER existed for Hunters before. Every single iteration of every single spec before Legion both had the ability to use a ranged weapon and a strong preference to use it as much as possible. Legion and BFA Survival are the ONLY exceptions. This is not a normal occurrence and it’s not a good change. It fundamentally disconnects the spec from its own class and this is why it underwent such heavy changes after its very first expansion and will likely get changed significantly next time too.
You have yet to add logic or fact to any argument. All you’ve said,
Ranged survival is bad, melee is better(opinion)
People have always played MM and BM over survival and wouldn’t play a ranged survival spec(MM has been historically PVP,until now while it’s clunky but does decent dmg, which is why people played survival, smoother spec and rotation, mostly PvE spec)
Ranged survival takes away from other specs(only true if they bake it into another spec, fourth spec fixes this and leaves melee Alone)
Ranged survival isn’t coming back(trolling/attacking thread, survival has been remade repeatedly since the melee catastrophe, from 2 fill revamps, to several ability changes)
Fourth spec is horrible idea(nothing to support this statement other than your opinion)
Ranged survival was never popular,(just wrong, was top DPS with smooth rotation PVE, even out pacing BM for a couple years in there for end game representation)
Then openly arguing against facts and ideas from people who would like to see the spec return .
At this point, had you made a good argument, it’s been forgotten in the chaos you’ve been trying to make in the thread. AKA derailing the thread.
It’s not a matter of not agreeing with you, obviously I don’t, but because you make no valid points, supported by anything aside from conjecture
I don’t need to prove anything to you champ.
Facts are facts, ranged SV isn’t coming back, unless Blizz does a 180. And that’s highly unlikely.
A fourth spec for a DPS class is not realistic, and problematic for a dozen reasons. Moreso Blizz has show if anything it is moving towards less specs i.e. demon hunters.
I like SV, so yeah I don’t want to see ranged SV return. Big surprise.
All classes are evolving.
Ranged dps used to be my favored role but I find it hard to find any ranged spec to my likings these days.
I’m seriously enjoying disc priest atm. But I did not enjoy it much prior the change to its current “dps healer” form. Go to priest forums, you’ll see post requesting the old disc back. With people aggreeing and disagreeing on the thread.
These can be found on all class forums in some ways. Some more intense than others.
I personnaly used to be a lock main, since vanilla troughout cata. I skipped mop and wod and camr back and the only thing I can think of since is:" look what they’ve done to my boy T_T"
I really dont care about fotm specc or if my favorite spec is performing well. Am I having fun with my spec? No. That’s sad but I moved on to other classes.
Hey OG dorf,
Yes my opinion like yours is meaningless, we’ve been over this already.
Ranged SV isn’t coming back, unless you show me otherwise, it’s a fact.
This argument is unnecessary, tuning and balance as well. Also demon hunterS.
Well it would be a survival Hunter with better movement and survivability than Arms, probably less burst… but that’s mostly a pipe dream. Obviously with Lonewolf you wouldn’t use KC…maybe raptor strike could be the focus generator.
That is what is important, if your happy with the game then that is you need to focus on.
This is a post geared towards players who miss range Sv and would like to see it returned. It is not meant to be a QQ thread, only a hope for something that is missing.
Opinions have meaning as long as they are not pushed as facts or downgrade other ideas. Everyone has opinions and you should not be afraid to share them, but you need to be open to other ideas as well.
Did I miss the announcement were Blizzard has stated that Range SV is gone and dead, so stop talking about it?
So, then how would you be able to do all this without KC? Otherwise, KC is not necessary for melee SV and is replaceable.
Well, Bepples and hundreds more would say the same for melee SV. If your allowed to praise melee SV then they are in the right to wish for range SV back.
Feels as if you hate being one of the few who gives preps to melee, and just want to cover your head until the noise from the crowds of range SV dies out.
Making up numbers doesn’t help your cause. Saying there are hundreds of people clamoring for ranged SV, when the only proof is the same half dozen people continually whining about it on the forums is disingenuous to say the least.