I’m pretty sure that’s what they always do, that’s why I don’t understand why people impart this level of omniscience to their class design team and then simultaneously tell me that every data set available on the internet means nothing. Okay, so what is Blizzard using. Wheel of fortune?
1 Like
Is that what you got from my post? I sincerely hope not. Subjectivity isn’t some evil demon, just something we need to understand and accept.
1 Like
Right, and it’s part of data analysis, removing that subjectivity, which, bear in mind, subjectivity is actually imparted upon analysis of raw data.
Data itself is just data. You actually sitting there and stating that a given data set has a mechanical flaw could actually be you imparting subjectivity in your reporting of it, but it’s apart from the data itself.
I don’t understand why somebody has to chime in every time someone posts logs and start rattling off flaws as if it cancels out the fact that it’s still data, and it’s still potentially relevant if you take those potential flaws into consideration. You’re never going to get an absolutely perfect data set. You can still do something with it. You can still look at it. It’s not going to bite.
For example, a lot of encounters are cleave heavy, or multi target, or actually execute heavy classes, or burst heavy classes are preferred. Okay, we should actually be able to get into the weeds on an encounter by encounter basis and say, based on these logs, and the mechanical attributes of this class, the class is both built for this and appears to be performing on this encounter. Then, in this Patchwerk encounter, you can see that your ST is generally falling in this range with this delta, etc.
I just don’t see the point in throwing up your hands at that stage unless you just don’t want to do it, which I can admittedly understand.
I just don’t see the fault in throwing up logs and graphs just so people have some context and can come to their own entirely reasonable conclusions, even if they’re mostly conjecture.
I also just don’t see the point in saying “well, it’s fine” and throwing up your hands, either, but I see that as the typical response to the chicken littles.
Any can be manipulated in many ways. At least when it comes to logs. I put more stock in sims than logs. Yeah, sims aren’t 100% either, but at least sims has a consistent stable factor. Logs can be skewed by public opinion, common perception, as well as cherry picking certain bits of data.
This is why I find it amusing when people say they can’t do “A”, “B”, or “C” because of class. Cause we have data to show people successfully doing those things. We can all agree, Fury certainly needs a buff. When and where, or better, “How” they buff it remains to be seen. Personally, another aura buff would be good, and either revert haste buff, or make Rampage hit like an absolute nuke. I mean, it is our primary spender and linchpin of the class.
Arms, not sure how they go about buffing it. Yeah they could do the PvE side and not the PvP effect. I know a few druids in that last BG that would appreciate them not buffing our pvp ability.
1 Like
Single biggest thing I’d like to see again. Whenever I do a Torghast run I’m just waiting for my first Rampage anima buff, then I’m happy because I remember how it was in BFA.
2 Likes
Fury felt like fury in later bfa.
Something about your character “arghing” while charging in popping off all over with rampage nuking targets just felt right.
Edit: make sure battle shout is macro’d to rampage for ultimate argh. Maybe charge too.
1 Like
Data is like raw ore. Until you smelt it, you can’t do anything with it. Warcraftlogs is essentially the smelting process, turning a bunch of arbitrary numbers into an organized set. Even then it means nothing until you create a mold and do something with the data.
The process of interpreting the data and discussing how the interpretation leads to action is what we’re doing here. That entire process is a subjective exercise. Part of why I think there are so many heated disagreements is that everyone has their own unique goal they want out of the game balance, so everyone ends up arguing for different things.
For example, some people think the top DPS shouldn’t be more than 5% higher than the bottom. That’s a nice, subjective goal. They use the data to demonstrate whether it is/isn’t the case (usually why it isn’t), then set out to use that data slice as an argument for making certain changes.
Now what if someone else thinks that every DPS spec should be at least above the average necessary DPS required to kill a boss before some enrage? That’s another perfectly fine, subjective mold. In that case, as long as the bottom is high enough, there’s no problem. Sure, it may mean the top is so high that undergeared progression racers utilize it more to offset the fact that tanks take more damage and healers heal for less until they are actually geared for the content. But does that mean action even needs to be taken?
So at the end of the day, I’m not saying throw out all data. I’m too old to dramatically exaggerate like that. I AM saying that anyone who uses data should define their goal, along with what action they think should be taken and when. That whole discussion though is purely subjective, and the interpretation of the data they use is up for debate.
At no point though is anyone anywhere being objective.
1 Like
You guys and your data paragraphs are really killing the mood. Snore
Nothing adds nitrous to my engine like some quality data. There’s no reason for anyone to believe me but I’ve been in the digital analytics industry for 12 years now, and I really enjoy it.
I’m not trying to kill the mood, I’m setting it. Now excuse me while I light these candles and turn on some soft jazz.
3 Likes
I get rejected faster from M+ queues than from matches on tinder
4 Likes
All melee are. It’s not just a warrior thing. The stigma certainly doesn’t help, especially in pugs. Just gotta remember, those groups are getting 10-20 dps requests very shortly after they’re advertised.
Oh sorry, let me correct it.
So we have to continue to suffer because the “best” guild decides it’s a good idea to have a warrior just for bs and rc. fantastic.
And, yes we are one of the worst next to Havoc DH, even if the best use them in Mythic lvl PvE content for one ability. I don’t see any fury warriors btw. At least arms is decent in pvp and a bit better on the parsing in ST pve. Fury isn’t really good at anything at all other than having rc.
Arms was not brought by Limit for BS & RC. FFS, they literally put out a video yesterday laying out why they brought them. They were brought for their damage.
3 Likes
where is this so called video? i would like to see this. i doubt it has anything to do with dmg.
“we only brought the arms worry for the spite.” hmm dmg huh? lol
Oh my god get your freaking hearing checked dude. Try again.
1 Like
That’s literally what he said. He didn’t go over jack about the warrior. It was literally only used for the spite. You obviously got confused.
You…wow.
-
This is a long video. He talks in detail about a lot. You watched 30 seconds and checked out the first chance you got. Lawl.
-
He said: “We only brought Arms warrior for this fight.”
You’ve just completely lost all your credibility, rather publicly. You’ve outright demonstrated you’re not even looking at the evidence in front of you, and you flat out can’t understand what you’re listening to or hearing - you don’t even get to the part where you can have an interpretation to argue with.
2 Likes
I listened for a bit, he essentially said that they had an ideal damage profile for Denathrius due to spread cleave with Condemn IIRC. Correct me if I’m wrong.
2 Likes