I did finish. Sylvanas talks about securing Lordaeron. She doesn’t mention Gilneas. And then Godfrey shoots her in the back of the head.
Jailer probably should have warned her about that with his prophecies.
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If by victory for the horde you mean return to the status quo before Garrosh ordered the invasion of Gilneas then sure.
The bargain was that Crowley will retreat his Gilnean Liberation Front forces back to Gilneas and in return his daughter would not be turned into an undead.
The Worgen vs Forsaken plot during Cata is basically WoW’s version of the Korean War simplified. Right down to the Forsaken (North Korea) invading, almost capturing the capital of Gilneas (South Korea) only to be pushed back by reinforcements from the Alliance (USA armed forces). Sylvanas, her new recruits and the Orcs pushing the Gilnean forces back could be seen as China getting involved in the conflict. And it ends the same, a formal but loose agreement on what the borders are. Although both sides know that the fighting has only ended for now.
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Golden actually could have had this be the moment Sylvanas sided with the Jailer rather than Silithus, given the text in the game after she dies at Silverpine:
- Lady Sylvanas Windrunner says: I saw… only darkness.
Lady Sylvanas Windrunner says: And as I drifted towards nothingness, a brilliant light appeared, then another, and another… My dear val’kyr.
Lady Sylvanas Windrunner says: I know now - beyond a shadow of a doubt - that the val’kyr are our future.
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Its not. What I mean by victory is an unconditional surrender and an abandoned Gilneas.
Crowley was never in position to give Gileans to anyone. He’s not Genn.
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I know, but that doesn’t negate an unconditional surrender and an abandoned Kingdom.
It rather does negate it. Crowley didn’t even have authority over Ivar and the Bloodpack that had been supporting his army.
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Except Gilneas was never abandoned. You see that during the 4.3 rogue legendary dagger chain.
It is just blizzard keeps flip flopping on it because they have no sense of consistency.
At this point it is Schrödinger’s Gilneas. Is it blighted and abandoned? Or does it have some form of population in it? We will never know until blizzard makes up their minds and settles on it for good.
End of Silverpine has Crowley withdraw his troops back to Gilneas. In the Legendary rogue chain we see that a black dragon has mind controlled some of the population in the city. You go in and assassinate the dragon.
But then in the finale of SoO, we have Varian who mentions that Gilneas is a blighted mess.
We need to investigate cleansing the plague from Gilnean lands so they can rebuild. We must contain Sylvanas. - https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Garrosh_Hellscream_(tactics)#Alliance
But there is no mention of the Forsaken blighting up Gilneas between the events of the Hour of Twilight and Siege of Orgrimmar. Note that blizzard liked switching between “blight” and “plague” for the Forsakens new “plague”. So which one is it?
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Except we know by Cata no one owned Gilneas. In fact, pretty sure BfA did have the worgen being told(outside the game of course) that they took back Gilneas.
Annoying that that was never talked about in the EK book.
In any case, we are 20 or so days from the next expansion reveal, so lets see what happens.
When were SA elements first inserted into the canon for what Arthas did to Sylvanas? Arthas’ invasion of Quel’thalas and turning Sylvanas in a banshee was always villainous, even without any SA elements. Most of the “Arthas did nothing wrong” - type talk I’ve heard was either an edgy joke or in regards to Stratholme or what he did prior to taking Frostmourne. Personally, I think he crossed the line into unambiguous villainy when Muradin pointed it out - when Arthas lied to his soldiers and betrayed the mercenaries who fought for him.
Sylvanas was to blame for doing war crimes to create her Blight reverse-engineered from Scourge plague and shares some culpability for Gilneas. Yet Putress’ Wrathgate betrayal wasn’t her idea and Garrosh is also to blame for what happened to Gilneas.
A nobody magically skilled at everything? Did Golden just turn Nathanos into a Mary Sue/Gary Stu/Marty Stu?
Worse, a player character.
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^^the crux of the discussion.
No one had authority over Genn who lost the Kingdom to Sylvanas. Counter attacks ultimately failed, the city was lost and abandoned and forgotten about.
I’m not saying that the Forsaken didn’t lose ground in Gilneas, I remember the Forsaken getting caught off guard “in the dead of night” like it was yesterday. I’m saying by the end of it all, Crowley(who you seem to be brushing to the side) lost Gilneas, Bloodfang forces were still hanging around in Hillsbrad.
Gilneas was abandoned and it seems as though Sylvanas didn’t want to bother with securing a city she didn’t want in the first place.
Edit: Gilneas and Genn are footnotes.
I think you missed Renautus bringing up several times that Sylvanas saw so much of herself in Genn and all the praise she had for him.
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There is a far better way to have handled everything in BFA, but it begins with less myopic writers. Outright lying about what was about to happen did them no favors either—“morally gray, faction pride, who burns Teldrassil is a surprise!”
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Gotcha, I understand but at the end of the day we have:
- Arthas
- Securing Lordaeron
- Forsaken Blight
- Insurrections
- Suicide
- Rubbing elbows with the Jailor
- Lanterns
- Warchief Sylvanas
- Teldrassil
- The Maw
And soooo many other things that took priority over Genn. Gilneas and Genn was one of those moments that Sylvanas truly felt like she could care less about, it felt like a “do I have to daaaddd” moment.
The Genn/Sylvanas rivalry means so much more to Genn than it did to Sylvanas. Even the way she reacted to Genn in Lordaeron’s throne room was sighhhhhhhh.
If Genn and Gilneas was so unimportant to Sylvanas she probably wouldn’t have dedicated a part of her bed time story to Anduin about it in this book.
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What a minute…its my brain. lol
I can not.
I will not.
I won’t not.
Renautus was also saying that Genn was a footnote in the Stormheim section, where the focus instead was on the Val’kyr never having actually been meant for the Forsaken and that Sylvanas had already been working for the Jailer at that point for the big reveal of what her deal was with Helya all along, and that the focus on Genn was rather in the Gilneas section.
Okay how does virtual books work on release dates? I’m not suffering so well.
This is killing me softly.
I NEED TO READ THIS NOW!
Should be available on midnight of the release date. At least the Exploring Kalimdor book was.