I think the biggest problem with the whole concept of orcish honor is that…. Well we still don’t know what it actually entails. It radically changes depending upon which writer is writing about it
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which doesn’t even come out until after
World of Warcraft: Slimfast Shake for Breakfast
and
World of Warcraft: Slimfast Shake for Lunch
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There is no honor by anyone in a world where absoloute monarchies like Stormwind or theocracies like Night elves still exist. They are just a bunch of arrogant douchebags who tell their children lies to make themselves look better then the “dirty savages”. That is all.
Thank you, I appreciate that comment! And I will try to keep up the respectful tone.
I get where you’re coming from about the narrative problems of Night Elves. I don’t disagree that it’s an issue.
But I don’t get your point. My point is that making either side happy is going to come at the expense of making the other side happy. If you disagree with that, are you saying Horde-focused players should enjoy seeing their favorites get steamrolled by Night Elves because they should be happy to see Night Elves looking competent? Does that really sound realistic to you?
I absolutely agree that you have a grievance, but so do I. My faction fantasy was destroyed every bit as much as the Night Elves’ was. We got Saurfang saying the entire Horde was rotten from the beginning and nothing we ever did was honorable. Not to mention losing all our leaders (not a single OG Horde leader from Vanilla is still in power), having our system of government replaced … not only do I not recognize the Horde I used to like anymore, but with one line of dialogue, it was retconned into never having existed in the first place.
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The night elves were outnumbered 12 to 1. In no realistc military scenario would it have made sense to let them win this battle. GRR Martin gets alot of crap for killing fan favorite characters but at least he researched military history when he write wars and battles.
Tyrande and Elune (and all night elves, tbqafh) are all power sues 2dmaxx!!
Sylvanas’s god had all souls as they died in the multiverse.
Elune is the Winter Queen’s sister, and did not.
Tyrande should’ve stood absolutely not one single percent of a chance.
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To be fair, it was never about winning. It was about stalling long enough for the night elf army to land. Because at that point, both sides acknowledge that the Horde would have been done with the invasion.
That’s also the in-universe justification for the night elves losing in Ashenvale/Darkshore. Because the whole attack was carried out against civilians and a skeleton guard force.
Which is just about the least orcish honor power fantasy you can get and yet another reason the whole thing was depressing.
On redside, you rely on a steady stream of deus ex machinas and war crimes, told how near a thing it is the whole time.
On blueside, it’s a sucker punch and you “got” to play through lovingly detailed failures, with hope just within reach only to be snatched away by the latest round of poorly explained writer fiat.
And then the payoff was BFA and Shadowlands soooooooo…
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Dread, if you were expecting Shadowlands to make narrative sense or be internally consistent at almost any point…
Well, I’m sorry.
We still don’t really understand Elune’s “power level”. Permanent eclipse? Slapping around Sylvanas until an abrupt and poorly explained change of heart? Star dragon? Trading centaur and orc heads for buffs? Yet a very hands off diety in general.
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If nelf players whine about tyrande not instantly killing (jailer-empowered) nathaniel and also every character in the setting, i can whine about tyrande merely continuing to exist after even entering Sylvanas’s presence.
It should’ve been a WWE no sell.
Tyrande should’ve accomplished absolutely nothing.
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Counterpoint: the jailer wasn’t actually that beefy in power outside of his home base. What he was was a manipulator. How much juice he could drop on a puppet was pretty variable as plot dictated, but it never seemed all that impressive.
And we still don’t really know Elune’s abilities or their extent.
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My son.
My sweet, summer child.
I have objective proof that you are wrong.
How did we, the godkiller, world ender, world saver 25 man player team do against Sylvanas?
Zovaal got all the souls of people who died after Argus was killed. So what? The four Covenants had been getting souls for eons upon eons since before Zovaal was even locked up in the Maw. The Covenants should have had so many souls working for them that Zovaal, who previously had been nothing but a glorified sorting hat, should have been crushed instantly the moment the way to and from the Maw was opened through Korthia.
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And been bleeding them to him, too.
Vampire daddy whose name escapes me had been using his statues to literally sap the other realms for time immemorial.
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I mean, it takes 25 of us to ruffle one (1) mage.
Or 3 black dragons.
Or an eldritch abomination.
Our power level is allllllllllll over the place.
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We could not defeat Sylvanas.
We couldn’t even get her to 49% health.
I soloed the Night Warrior.
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Given we killed said vampire his surplus of anima did not seem significant to his power.
I also remember getting mauled by a random yeti the argent crusade kidnapped.
And I’ve absolutely been “enoughed!” a few times by characters who aren’t that beefy in Dragonflight.
I’m not convinced that the player character is a good yardstick for in-universe smackdown potential.
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No you didn’t. Lore wise Shandris was protecting you throughout the fight.
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My son.
My sweet, s-night child.
Oh boy
A worthless warrior was beside the DEATHLORD.
I guess I could use another ghoul. 