When did that happen?
I take it you haven’t played the class? Shadowform would be an infusion of sorts. If you choose the talent Void Eruption you are transformed in to a Void Form, which has tendrils etc. which is a transformation, albeit temporarily.
Souls are part of the WoW lore.
Yes or no. Since you want to be absolutist you have to stick to it.
Is a Void Elf a blood elf? IS a Void elf drained of Void a blood elf?
Is a Blood Elf using Voidal magic a Void Elf? Is a Blood Elf transformed into Illidain with warlock magic a Void Elf?
This is inane.
Your own insane scrutiny maybe.
Mine holds up to the facts of the universe.
A dead Void Elf is a High Elf. You can look at their soul to confirm this. You’re just wrong.
Didn’t you say you were “done”
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The only reason I said yes and no, is because they can change back. Read the whole thing and not take it out of context.
So do Druids change their race? In the same fantasy sense of how Race is used? No. But they do if you consider a Bear a different race to a Night Elf. I’d use species but if you say a bear is a race, then I would say yes they change races. In the fantasy world it’s not as big as a deal though.
I’m not going down this rabbit hole with you, someone already has.
Which universe?
That DK NPC must really get your goat then.
I have a problem. I like to have the last word. I am done talking with you about the Theory of Evolution as quoted… if you notice.
I mean do you consider Dark Irons and Wildhammer/Bronzebreads the same race?
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Theyre totally the same race 
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Then you are consistent! And we disagree and so does the NPCs/game world, but I get it.
Is there evidence Void Elves aren’t “changing back” when not using entropic embrace?
as long as you know you’re wrong.
The one we’re talking about.
So Death Knights are a different race than their living counterparts?
So Undead and Dark Rangers are a different race from Humans and elves?
Weren’t you just arguing they were the opposite?
Obviously.
… Yes? They’re literally the same species.
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What definition of Race are we even talking about here.
Because in WoW a race is not the same as the IRL shorthand, because Humans, regardless of melanin content, are the same race in WoW.
Ergo it must be the typical fantasy definition that is synonymous with species.
So are all the dwarves, the same species? Yes. Three of them are all customization options for one dwarf race, Dark Irons are only a “allied race” separate from them because they’re allied, not an original alliance race.
Honestly you could easily argue WoW Defines race by “customs” rather than by any biological difference.
That would explain why Kul’tirans are a different “Race” from humans- why Gilneans who aren’t even afflicted by the worgen curse are categorized differently from either of the prior two.
So there’s really no merit to the argument in the first place. A Void Elf who adopts High Elf customs is a High Elf. A Blood Elf who adopts Void Elf customs is a void elf.
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Which one? You brought in the Theory of Evolution.
I have consistently said no they are the same race. You and Norkah have said yes they are different.
The Void Elf DK was a Blood/High Elf who got transformed into a Void Elf post Undeath. Like any Blood/High Elf could.
Again… I’m the one being consistent here.
What kind of Undead and Dark Ranger? Are Riftstalkers a different race? Blood Knights? Sunwalkers?
But not the same race?
The snark and rude comments are unwarranted and unwanted, can you have more character? I don’t mind sarcasm, this is different.
Void Elves are the only race who can do it presently among other void transformed beings, so there’s no changing going on.
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Tbh i think the wow universe just lacks a solid definition of what a race is.
It jumps between different species and the definition used for the different races of irl humans whenever it feels like it.
So it makes it hard to really narrow down and you just sort of have to go with what feels right sometimes.
Fatansy settings do.
However, I am using the constant lore and history that once there’s a magical transformation, they are a new race. Trolls> Night Elves > (Nightborne)-(High/Blood Elf) > Void Elf.
To say I’m wrong is just odd, to say you disagree, okay that’s fine.
Dark Irons are transformed dwarves by Ragnaros, they can still have babies with other Dwarves. They and story, lore, etc consider them a different race to Wildhammer/Bronzebeards. There’s some folks who think because of some lore language that Wildhammers are misrepresented and are not the same race as Bronzebeards because it said “taller.” The reason I bring this up is, they say this while promoting Void Elves as the same race as Blood/High Elves while also saying Blood and High Elves aren’t the same race.
So I am used to the zealotry in these threads.
Void elf done his new armor
I am now a paladi-
You smell something burning?
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Problem is, when saying a magical transformation is enough to be a different race, youre left open to the most arbitrary differences being eligible.
Would a blood elf who magically gained a 6th finger be a new race? Its a magical transformation.
Also in the case of the void elves, weve not been told that if they reproduce the child would be voidy.
And if their offspring isnt then can we really say there was a single generational race change?
And with blood elves and high elves, theyre totally the same race.
So are void elves. I would say theyre the 3 groups of thalassian elves with thalassian being their race.
Although if void elf children come out void as well, perhaps sub-race would be more applicable. Still 99% the same thing though. So perhaps not.
More clarity is needed from blizzard though before i could comfortably move them in to a sub race classification.
Blood elves are the closest thing to being the group of elves from the rts games. And do carry on the legacy of the race.
High and void are spin offs from that legacy.
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No, that’s minimizing the transformation. We’re not just talking like Druids transforming in to a different species. We’re talking full on change in characteristics, etc. It’s a major and permanent one.
Going in this direction you’re proposing, you cannot explain why Night Elves are no longer Trolls. The only thing left would be “culture,” well any race can be a part of a culture. That’ll leave you with physical characteristics, which then again shows how High/Blood Elves are a separate race from Void Elves. Just like Dark Irons and the other Dwarves.
Agreed. If it’s a one time thing, then I would admit I am wrong.
Thalassian as an umbrella term, for “race” and they are different “races” yes. This is where that funny fantasy setting thing comes in with the word race. In DnD Moon and High Elves lore wise are the same race but are not the same as Wood. Shade, Star, etc. Or even in LOTR you may be talking to who the Elves see as a High Elf but you wouldn’t be able to tell them a part.
Runeleaf walked me through this and I conceded yep, I had the wrong view on this. Yep, they are also inheritors of the Quel’Dorei legacy, so I get why some would continue to identify as a High Elf. Just like I see how some Blood Elves would have no problem identifying as a High Elf.
shrugs Some people just want to fight.
Its not. Its just pointing out that there isnt a hard line on what is and isnt enough of a magical transformation to be a new race.
Thats all i was getting at.
Yes and I am marking where it is in the lore. It’s permanent and unchangeable. Curse of Flesh falls in this too.
Yes but a permanent and unchangeable 6th finger
It’s not drastic enough or major enough.
That’s what I meant by it’s minimizing the transformation with your comment.
It seems disingenuous or pedantic.
Its not being disingenuous or pedantic.
If you dont think a 6th finger is enough to be a new race, then that means you think there is a line on what is and is not enough.
That line has not been established as a concrete and measurable thing which leaves it up to interpretation.
And when its left to interpretation, its hard/ impossible to say what is and isnt.
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Again this goes back to when I said:
“To say I’m wrong is just odd, to say you disagree, okay that’s fine.”
I have defined my line enough and over and over again. I have shown how Blizzard has interpreted their own Lore to define a new race. So it suggests they seem more aligned with me. Until I see something differently from them, I’m sticking with my point of view. It’s based in evidence.
One can disagree with me, that fine. Again, I consider it odd. However, everyone can have a personal opinion.
Where the problem lies is asserting, I am wrong. I am not even saying you are wrong, notice? I’m actually agreeing more so.
What’s funny to me is, I am asserting a positive and show my evidence. Yet continually I’m met with personal attacks, no evidence to support their positive, and asserting the negative which is a fallacy unto itself.
If you don’t know what that means here you go:
No fish are dogs, and no dogs can fly, therefore all fish can fly.
The only thing that can be properly inferred from these premises is that some things that are not fish cannot fly, provided that dogs exist.