If it doesn’t make sense to you, I think you’re being dishonest.
If you have made it to 619 with 4/6 Hero gear as a Delver only, you are clearly already incredibly dedicated to have reached this point. See: the previous math problems posted.
If you, a Delve only player, have been dedicated enough to make it to 619, why would you not try to go even further since you have already invested all of this time? Clearly, upgrading gear is a very satisfying and engaging thing for you to do.
Meh, we’ll probably be into S2 before I cap the several characters I play at 619. And even the one or two I do get to 619 before then, well that is just the end for them until new content releases. Frankly I’m fine with that.
And again: If a delver who gets to that point wants to try M+, I say let them.
But how many delvers are going to go M+ with the “BLAH I DON’T WANNA DO THIS BUT I MUST ANYWAY!!!”?
And you said it yourself, with the math problems, that very few people are even going to be in this boat to begin with.
So, if you get a couple Hero pieces from Delves, most Delvers are never going to get to the point where the only path forward is to jump to M+.
However…
The Hero pieces dropping in Delves leaves the door open for a Delver to go “yanno, I wanna try this M+ thing…”
The Hero pieces would certainly help that.
Yup, which is why if Delver only players got Champion gear, it would make no difference to them at all and we as a community wouldn’t have to deal with the toxic consequences it has created
I don’t think they are using delves to shelve players into Mythic+. But they still value Mythic+ and raids over delves probably. But delves are very new and Mythic+ and raiding have been around for a lot more years. Delves need time to grow. I think there needs to be more to them.
They want mythic raiding and Mythic+ to be more elitist and Delves to be more the content most people play that supports/finances the elitism content. If they pushed everybody into raiding it would defeat that intended vision. They’d have to raise the ilvl of Normals and LFR to make them relevant again.
They don’t want most people to Mythic+ just a certain kind of player. Respectfully you kind of have it backwards I think. But they know that financially speaking people who push that hard in the game are a minority and cannot finance the thing on their own. Because it’s an mmorpg not a moba or e-sport, as much as they want that to be otherwise. Without delves, too many people would cancel their account.
But yet you slam the door shut on delvers who DO want to try M+.
And who exactly is toxic? The newbies trying to dip their toes into M+ or the elitist min-maxxers and elite players who think that everybody who isn’t awesome is terrible and should quit the game blah blah blah?
The best gear should be reserved in an MMORPG for the content its intended for. You don’t need mythic raid gear to do wqs and delves. There’s literally no reason for delve-only players to be needing it in easy mode content.
Wrong. I beat zekvir ?? on DH after about 5-10 hours with an ilvl of about 610? Which is easy with delves and a brann of lvl 30 something(post-nerf brann, not the OP version before hotfix). Zekvir is both a skill check and a gear check to a degree, but its not that harsh. And no, ilvl 620+ isnt gonna melt Zekvir either. Still a skill based challenge.
You can farm delve gear all the way to 626 if you really wanted to, it’s just going to be a mind numbing amount of delves.
You can get gilded crest from treasure maps and the hidden chest at the end of high lvl delves
That’s your opinion.
I’m of the opinion that one should be able to progress for as long as the season lasts. Now obviously higher end content lets you progress faster, but progress should always exist.
Right now, Delves are designed so that for most people, they won’t run out of progression before the season ends if they do Delves, and only Delves. And that’s great that it’s like that.
So long as the content is all rebalanced around it sure. I don’t particularly care if my gear says Hero or Champ on it. But delves, the encounters, and the gear progression is all balanced around getting to that Hero gear. I kind of doubt Blizz wants to rework all of that just to satisfy a few M+'ers having a whinefest.
No it’s not . I’ve done most of my gearing via delves and you can check I have no mythic dungeons.
Nothing is making people do content they don’t like other then themselves.
Not even remotely close to true. Herein lays the issue.
The described delvers reach 619 with their hero gear, they want to keep upgrading it.
They can easily get an adequate score to join 8s or make their own 8s, especially at this point in the season where more people are familiar with dungeons than those who are not. If you’re 619 and trying to learn how to play M+ Dungeons on week 12 of M+ being out, you will likely start in some low keys like 2-6 where everything dies super duper fast and doesn’t get their mechanics out, you’re not dying from misplay yet, etc.
You, as a Delver, eventually reach 7-9 where there is a steep difficulty curve in the scaling. Suddenly, things are alive long enough to do 2 sets of mechanics. Kicks get missed, you get 1 shot for misplay, etc. The Delver is left scratching their head ‘huh what happen?’ because these weren’t readily apparent issues in lower key levels.
So, because of their ability to completely outgear keys and therefore not need to LEARN them, they end up in groups they’re not ready for. They play poorly, they die, it holds the whole group back and wastes everyone’s time.
it is also very obvious when someone is a Delver only. Painstakingly so.
Yah the thing is that 8/8 Champion == 4/6 Hero. They are the same gear. The name is different.
Since when are business decisions intended to modify the behavior of your customer base to “encourage” them to spend more money a “conspiracy theory”?
You can also get them from crest conversion too which ppl here are ignoring.
If I didn’t drop my priest for Mage I’m pretty certain o would’ve been around 622-623 with a 636 staff for delves alone last month.
People whining about toxicity that they themselves cause when they try to push out newbies who are trying to dip their toes into new content, and then they can turn around and go “LOL U SCRUB YOU DON’T EVEN DO M+” … eh, yeah, there’s a reason why a lot of people never try M+.
The Toxic M+ Community is pretty high up on the list.
Or they will see that it requires M+ and go “Nah I’m good.” and stop there.
You’re an M+ player. You’re looking at delvers through the same lens that you and your fellows look at M+.
Plenty of delvers do not think like you. They don’t feel this uncontrollable itch to make numbers go higher.
People will seek better gear and gear upgrades until it becomes too much of a hassle, at which point the majority of them will stop because it’s no longer fun.
The % of people who will delve all the way up to 619 is probably… quite small. The % of people who feel pressured or forced to enter M+ is probably non-existent.
Took me 65 attempts at 621 ilvl with a lvl 19 Brann
The fight can be a little RNG, but as long as your Brann can keep you healed and you treat boss like a marathon instead of a DPS sprint it’s not too bad
You don’t need high octane gear if you can’t or don’t want to do high octane content.
Delvers are notoriously bad at doing even the easy content made for yall.
Gear is a tool to complete a task.
If you’re just word processing and doom scrolling tiktok you don’t need a 4k dollar pc.
So Delve gear being limited to Champion is reasonable and just?
Thanks for playing
No, because Blizz wants Delvers to have the option of trying out M+.
They’re not forced to, but they want the option to exist.
And being able to get Hero gear out of Delves immensely helps with that, while also adding some encouragement that most delvers probably wouldn’t be seeing as forcing it.
There’s also the matter of Tier Gear.
I don’t want to waste feathers on Champion gear because what if I did eventually get a Hero piece? I’d wanna save my feathers for Hero “Just in Case” I ever had the opportunity to go above Hero 4.