Actually, Delves seem to be the reason a number of players aren’t doing M+ anymore.
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Don’t matter if you make your own group or try to join a group to be honest. Try to make your own and your group sits in group finder for hours and nobody wants to join it.
Try to join someone else’s group and you get denied because they look up your IO and see you’ve not done anything yet.
(Press X to Doubt.)
I dunno, most of the time I’ve bumped into M+ players, they acted like they had a 50ft pole shoved somewhere a 50ft pole don’t belong, IE, they were so full of themselves that they couldn’t do anything else but spew their crap everywhere because they couldn’t contain it anymore.
Yeah, because some people who were struggling at the entry level saw Delves and go “why the frick am I banging my head against this crap?” and went to Delves instead, where they can either solo or just pick up a friend or three and avoid all the nonsense that goes on in M+.
Does not happen, not for hours. Any time someone makes that claim, it’s because they rejected the first few tanks /healers for not being good enough.
Anyone insisting average mythic plus is timed content is either playing beyond their level or just bad which is essentially the same. If you do m+ at appropriate levels and skill the timer should exist. Upper keys as in title range does of course because gear and the skill floor only goes so far.
So stop with the whole crying about timed content.
I mean that makes sense. Why would I want somebody who’s unqualified?
Works in reverse too: Why would I want to join the group when the keyholder is clearly unqualified?
This is literally you exhibiting the same behaviors. “MAN I FEEL SO GREAT NOT DOING M+ AND BEING FREE THE RAT RACE FULL THOSE SIMLY ELITISTS, I’M DOING DELVES AND GETTING CRUMBS OF GEAR EVERY WEEK WITH NO CRESTS TO REASONABLY UPGRADE IT YIPPIE” and so on and so forth is the same energy as the psychopaths that complain about delves giving too much loot.
I’ve an answer for this one: I hope it’s someone’s alt, and they might actually invite me.
(When I was at the +12 wall.)
OK, so… you don’t want to accept someone into your group or join someone who started a group who is “unqualified” which means they need experience, they need IO, they need gear… how exactly are they supposed to get something they are required to already have before you’ll accept them?
EDIT: You’ll probably say something like “someone ELSE can do it but I won’t” … but if everybody takes that same attitude, well… might as well not even try then. It’s a Gated Community afterall.
Uh? Where did I type in all caps and say anything close to that? Hyperbole does you no credit.
You group with people of your skill level or below so you get invites.
Like I was seeking out 2500 keyholders for +12 when I was at 2700 because it’s better than playing lfg simulator.
And you don’t wait for people to carry you, in your own key.
Every post you have in this thread screams this. It is hyperbole but this:
mirrors it.
You start at M0, get a key or start doing +2s, then move up. Don’t skip steps. Work your way up. Do the work. Have a willingness to learn and grow. Then you start doing +4s and +5s, then you start doing higher keys, more and more. If you put in the work, you’ll be doing 10s in no time. Goes way faster if you find a group of friends or a guilde to do this with. Be apart of the community.
So ok, the brand new newbie who’s never done M+ before is supposed to somehow find people “of his own skill or lower” … like there’s a ton of those around that are seeking to M+… let’s say he gets into +1 or +2 or what-not…
The larger part of the M+ population isn’t going to give him the time of day because he has nothing, and they have no reason to run such low keys.
You take anyone that signs up for your group.
Like other people at zero.
And the few at 1k whatevers.
Nobody vets for +2s unless you’re at a stupid low Ilvl. And if you are stupid low ilvl, you have multiple forms of content to gear (heroic dungeons, M0, LFR). 4s are probably where vetting comes in but if you have a good amount of keys + ilvl you are fine. 7s is entirely down to IO and key completed because at that point unless you are stupidly high geared, your poor play can brick keys very easily.
I honestly depends. Like when me and guildes are knocking out 10s for the week we’ve deff grabbed like 620 dps that have all 9s cleared because we can just carry then. I personally will just apply to somebody’s group provided their io isn’t super far off or weird (like a 1.5k io person listing a +10 or +11). The only thing that will give me pause is if I see that the tank is super low ilvl because it means theres a high likely hood I will end up pulling off them during burst (or if I proc DRE), say like the tank is like 615 for a GB or CoT. Timing also matters. If I’m trying to farm crests quickly so I can upgrade something or craft before raids, I’m gonna go with higher IO groups or Higher Ilvl groups. If im casually doing it, I’m much lax with my vetting, sometimes leading to inviting some players clearly not ready.
I can tell that even when I put in my note that main is 2.7k io when applying to keys on my 617 Lock whos like around 1.85 k IO, I still will get denied for 6-7-8s which makes sense. I have the gear and clearly I’ve done high keys but there’s no guarantee I play my alt just as well as I play my main. Which I absolutely don’t, I pretty sure I play pretty mediocre on my lock. After getting some lower keys done, I found myself getting invited to those keys more frequently.
I do think that at this point in the tier, people are needlessly too strict with who they let in for their +10s. Lower keys it does somewhat matter. But the main thing that gets you by is a willingness to learn. I did a +7 Mist on my Lock whos 617 with a tank at 619, a 614 healer, a 619 war, and a 616 enhance. It did not go well because the shaman did not run Poison Cleanse totem or Curse dispel for Devour and some deaths to lack of awareness (mainly frontals, standing stuff, getting hit by balls on mistcaller). We did like 5 attempts on Mist caller but due to lack of CC, no cleanses other than my imp led to the affix to heal the boss, we ended up calling it. I offered to give some feedback to them but the Shaman told me off saying its a healer mechanic (its an EVERYONE mechanic). The war stayed and we chatted about some stuff and ended up doing another key together and he did better (it was mostly issues with being aware of mechanics since he was doing good damage). It might not be super gear rewarding but doing Lower keys is super valuable since its where you can learn more about your spec at a comfortable pace.
What? You don’t like content turned up to absolutely bonkers difficulty that only basement sweat beasts can complete, then isolate the majority of the game population and several classes just for existing? Why? I could see if they lost all sense of reason and added a timer or something that made “extremely difficult” turn into “absolutely not fun whatsoever”, but c’mon!
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The notion that we’re all chasing higher ilvl, or only need to, to run mythics is false logic. I don’t WANT to run mythics. 90% of players I know do not want to run mythics. I want to run heroic raids consistently, without struggling and wiping. Whatever content you desire, we all agree it would be nice to feel powerful after months of hard work, right? Anyone that’s reached the 610+ ilvl is still feeling weak while also being at a loss for progressing without doing what many agree is insufferable content.
Why should end game content be unenjoyable? Can’t we progress AND have fun? Why do those two things have to be exclusive of each other when both could co-exist?
heroic raid is doable with normal raid loot.
You don’t need to run m+ at all, or delves.
With Delves and Follower Dungeons solo players have access to a lot more than we did before. As for end game, we have Story Mode Raids to see how the whole thing ends. Maybe Story Mode could be extended to the entire raid rather than just the final boss.
As for Heroic Dungeons, if we are doing Follower Dungeons are we missing anything that appears in the Heroic version of dungeons?
Here’s the thing: I don’t care if you want Delves to award good gear and have it’s own progression, but it absolutely should not award Mythic track gear unless you want to make it Mage Tower on steroids level of difficult which wouldnt end well. If they make it easy, players will bypass the raid difficulties and go straight to Mythic and they dont want that.
Delves are a safe progression to get you to Heroic gear. You do NOT need more than heroic gear and if you think you do, join the rest of us in the raid and get it them. Don’t like it? Sorry coach but uhhh it’s an MMO, not a single player game. Gotta join us at some point
Getting 1 piece of maybe Hero gear per week is not going to let you “skip the raid difficulties”, not unless you want to wait the entire season to get geared up.
I mean, didn’t we have this same conversation back when M+ first came out? “How dare people only go in repeatable dungeons in groups of 5 and get raid-quality gear!? You should have to do raids to get raid-quality gear!” or “People are just gonna skip raids and go straight to m+!”
There’s still plenty of reasons to go to M+ or Raids, like Crests or maybe someone wants a shot at more than 1 chance a week at Hero gear. (well, IIRC, it’s 2 chances because of Timewalking, but we’ll ignore that exists because after January it goes away)
You do realize that if Blizzard made a delve level the same difficulty as a +10, you would be incapable of doing it right?
Hopefully blizzard keeps the reward level of Delves the same, because it seems people have really enjoyed them.