Twinks in their separate Q's - Don't let them get away with this

[Tailo-gilneas]

These arguments for twinks just keep getting weaker.
Lmao

[Crustyudder-illidan (Crustyudder)]

Crusty this is the problem with the cognitive dissonance among players like you.

A separate queue for twinks is essentially removing the rbg button from these players. The queues won’t happen. AND if that IS the intention, then blizzard should just outright disallow xp off players from pvping period then.

This sounds harsh, but this is the reality with what they just did. They killed twink pvping, but they don’t want to look like dewche bags by outright banning twinks for pvping so they just marginalize them. This is what shady people do in all aspects of life, and if you are ok with this then just outright say it instead of hopscotching around your disingenuous moral arguments.

I don’t twink, but this method of handling twinking is stupid and doesn’t really fix the problem. It’s lazy and shadily cuts out a segment of players from doing what they like to do.

like for real, if the people on these forums were just real for a second and straight up said “I think twinking is wrong, and twinks shouldn’t be allowed to pvp” then i’d be easier to understand each side instead of having to wallow through these half-baked “arguments” as to why separate queues are good.

hate twinking all you want, my intentional gripe is with segregating queues in random battlegrounds. It’s just a bad practice in general.

It’s not cognitive dissonance bud. Do I need to throw a dictionary definition at you?

If something has a negative effect elsewhere you need to consider what will be healthier in the long run. Perpetually beating on people who are trying to level and doing pvp for some portion of that is a negative for the players who are getting whacked.

Twinks as a concept arn’t explicitly an issue. The issue is when they are able to indefinitely stay within a level bracket. The original version of the game made level 19 twinking popular because it was easy to get to that level. But it still required the effort to get there providing some level of disincentive and preventing someone from non-stop hammering any given bracket indefinitely. With the addition of xpoff they removed the effort required to maintain a character that can bash through people who are using it for fun when trying to level and learn their character.

Also - Fun fact: Pvp twinkers arn’t the exclusive users of the xpoff system. Assuming so is incredibly self centered. Stop trying to throw the baby out with the bath water.

I don’t hate twinkers, infact I honestly couldn’t care less about them. What I do care about is the amount of fun that can be derived from a BG. Having people who have up to 9 levels above you with fully optimized gear isn’t fun to play against, and thus not healthy for the system. If everyone was like that, it wouldn’t matter, but they arn’t and until they find a better fix for it separate queues make the most sense.

[Handcake-hyjal (Handcake)]

This has been a thing for years. Thing is what if you can’t make it for the 2-4hrs a week the twink community schedules? Screwed, right? YUP. With being added to the regular queue, it might mean a 20min queue but you can still get a game.

I don’t really do twink pvp, but I did about 20 games of 110 this xpac and it was so random. Sometimes it is premade vs randoms. Sometimes 2 premades vs 1 or vice versa. But games could happen 24/7. With this change, 110s can do premades vs premades but for what, 4hrs a week? Glad I pay $15 a month to be told when I can play this game. (Actually not glad, and I can see the anger of the twinks…what if I told you you could only raid from 6am to 10am Sunday mornings or no raids? Think about it for a bit from the other side…)

[Kitiare-sisters-of-elune]

I don’t even twink and I know this is a fail. I feel like instead of focusing on real problems in the game they keep finding ways to piss off the playerbase. I’ve turned off XP on a few toons (for other purposes not twinking ralated) and I was furious when they decided to auto enable it.

There seems to be a definite agenda against twinking by Blizzard and I can’t understand their reasoning.

Instead of trying to force everyone to play the way they envision us playing they need to realize everyone plays in a different way, And enjoy different things.

[Patrkstwrt-sargeras]

Good riddance.

[Inhuman-frostmane]

Alright. There is a lot to read here and I can’t get through it all on my lunch break.

I’ve been looking into both sides, and a lot of issues has to with a culmination of a lot of things. Me personally I’ve played since vanilla (when bgs didn’t give up) and remember stopping at *8/9 to pvp ad I leveled (and aquired gear from quests and dungeons). I’ve done some high end PvP (mostly in tbc and wrath), mythic raiding, M+ etc.

Some things to note : balancing and availability of items from non dungeon sources is currently garbage. That’s on blizzard. Questing is pretty much just a time sink in between dungeon queues for DPS at this point while leveling and j think that’s dumb. How that ties into thinking though, is that twinks have had more time to farm this gear but especially in 10-29 area, questers will have substantially less good gear than dungeon runners or twinks. I’ve taken a dungeon geared toon with a few enchanted heirlooms and done absolutely fine vs. twinks. I’ve played a twink and loss to non twinks with good coordination.

There are some problem brackets, such as brackets with socket gear and 110-119 cuz legendaries and event gear scaling. Gear availability for questers and sockets/legendary/gf event gear should be on Blizzard to fix imo.

Twinks don’t make up a majority of queues past 29, and personally I don’t enjoy thinking at that low of a level because I want to play with more of a class identity (I play 49 personally).

For me I’m fine going vs equal geared players, but at 49, xpoff literally doesn’t get queues. (19/29 does just fine because ease of access imo - and most bis at those levels was boas and is just dung gear mostly now.)

People can still make leveling twinks, so sure you won’t have the same people in bracket queueing with you (and if there was that means there aren’t that many people in the bracket is there) and stomp. Like I said it’s mostly boa and dung gear which both are easy to aquire.

I think the major issues to address are leveling players don’t wanna be roflstomped (which can and still will happen occasionally) and twinks (esp. past level 29) want to be able to queue solo without having to coordinate groups and times. There are a lot of players but there are also zone cutoffs, eu vs us. And like a lot of high end stuff, (high m+, high end raiding, high end arena) there isn’t a HUGE player base. But it is significant.

There are plenty of ways to resolve this rather than splitting groups. I.E. base template below x ilvl. Or more readily available, quality gear from quests and non dungeon sources. Or both. Tuning big offenders (ele force, crusader, ammo, op trinkets, sockets, leggos, gf event gear). It would just take more work from blizzard.

But blizzard is a small indie company and $15/mo from everyone isn’t enough to fund that, or promote a clear communication about a fairly major change for a portion of the player base. It’s easier to just split the group’s I guess but not resolve the actual problematic issues.

/Rant

P.S. I’ve posted a similar rant on another thread as my warlock, Ahnku. I just wanted to post on my rogue, that I’ve had since vanilla.

[Kiaryel-terenas]

Your timing is bad on this. You should have waited for a month or so and then people would have leveled up their allied races, now people won’t be able to see this.

Ah, I think you fail to see the point.

The twinks were (from those I know in particular) looking foward to reaping the wealth off lowbies bg’ing on the way to 120. I’m sure not all of the twink community was, but of the 6 People I know who have twinks all of them were.

[Idun-wyrmrest-accord (Idun)]

Twinks are one of the only things keeping low level BGs and low level content in general alive.

I know twinks love to say this, ignoring the dissonance that they can’t get their own queues to pop, and, that as before, non-twink queues are still popping. Just like they did when the queues were separated the first time. Which only proves that…

…You need non-twinks. Non-twinks don’t need you.

Never believe your own press.

[Shadrock-arygos (Shadrock)]

Outing myself, this character was created as a level 19 twink in vanilla. Bgs didn’t give exp back then so it was fairly common to have a twink character. Also, being contained to one server made for some fun rivalries. Of course, even way back then true noobies were fodder.

Blizzard has tried various tweaks over the years, such as splitting the bgs into 5 level brackets, xp on/off and stat templates.

I didn’t do much twinking after cross server bgs, but if I recall the twink community was strong during the last iteration of xp off bgs.

I seriously doubt those hardcore twinkers are in this thread, they are probably busy putting together a plan to arrange twink bgs or waiting for classic.

Whatever your reason for twinking, it’s hard to deny that a lone twink can undermine the experience for all the other players in the bg. I think it’s obvious that is not Blizzards intention, as well as being a drag for non thinks who enjoy queueing for lowbie bgs.

Random BGs will always been inequitable as long as groups can queue with solo players, but removing godlike twinks from the equation is a solid step in the right direction. The only truly fair iterations of bgs are rated.

[Idun-wyrmrest-accord (Idun)]

The difference is, the people leveling, have tons of other options to level, why is it, that because you don’t feel like questing, and experiencing the CONTENT the developers have put forth, that the minority that find something they enjoy the game with, can’t enjoy it.

There’s be XP in BGs for longer now than without. That shipped sailed in Wrath.

[Pípíkaula-proudmoore]

If it’s twinks “keeping the lower levels alive” you all should have more than enough to keep your xpoff queues going.

[Cigs-kiljaeden]

You are the definition of why blizzard now caters to peons who keyboard turn. @ Shadrock-arygos

[Malms-thrall (Malms)]

lol, low lvl PvP twinks are the worst kind of people… I hope blizzard gives you your own queue!

twink: we keep low lvl pvp alive
everyone else: don’t care. but ok
blizzard: here have your own xp off battleground! twink as hard as you can and have fun!!
twink: queue times are high… no one is queuing
everyone else: our queues are fine , having fun
blizzard: I thought twinks carried low lvl pvp??? our data is off
twinks: *cry

[Yayayayayaya-area-52 (Yayayayayaya)]

This has been done before and has failed before with massive damage to the game. Imagine if they removed flying for a second time?

This was my favorite part because the two aren’t even close. Thanks, OP.

[Vicktoria-area-52 (Vicktoria)]

The raw power of the human male paladin is palpable.

[Maizou-proudmoore (Maizou)]

Twinks are one of the only things keeping low level BGs and low level content in general alive.

Wait, so your the only ones keeping this content alive and yet your can’t survive in your own queue? I mean if you are the only ones doing said content, it really shouldn’t matter because all those players you would have run into would have been fellow twinks (and maybe the rare non twink who took a wrong turn) right?

Clearly that is not the case and you are actually a minority and one the majority clearly complained about enough that things were changed.

This. If there were truly enough twinks keeping the bgs alive, you’d have zero issues getting into the bgs.

No. The people keeping the content alive are the questers doing bgs for fun.

They are separating you for a reason.

[Timbourine-frostmourne (Timbourine)]

absolute madlad, please think of the children!

[Timbourine-frostmourne (Timbourine)]

My favourite part about this thread is you keep asking the same question and they twink supports cannot actually give you an answer that isn’t a literal “Yes, that’s exactly the reason”.

I love this thread so much god damn.

[Applejack-tichondrius (Applejack)]

The solution here to hold the flag as a twink xp on and not cap the entire match

[Dreta-stormrage]

Do. Not. Let. them. Get. Away. With. It.

I most certainly will, because I literally don’t care about the issue at all.