Possibly. I mean, that’s quite a subjective statement (not that I disagree), as (at least I think) we do not have a definitive source stating precisely why changes were made.
There could well have been more issues. However, the one that I remember and thought of as being the most obvious, due to all the complaints on the forums was that Alliance players were being removed from premade groups, and unable to play. That seems to be supported by the threads I’ve linked to.
A few naxx geared 60’s can be very powerful, but if given the choice to que vs rando naxx 60’s and premade rankers in blues I will go happily vs the naxx 60 randos because at least there a solo player actually has a chance to win.
That’s how powerful organized team play actually is.
it’s not that i don’t want you to have fun. it’s that i dont care if you do or not.
if you dont have fun playing classic, don’t play classic.
glad we have you here to make these decisions for us, thanks karen
I’m not an expert on this all but, I don’t think many of the people complaining about premades are really complaining about their existence so much as they are complaining about their solo queue team being matched against a premade. Pretty much every even remotely competitive game i’ve played has separated premades from fighting solo queuers in all but the most extreme circumstances even for unranked games. The answer should be obvious then, just do what those games do right? Well, then how do you calculate premade vs premade honor? solo queue vs solo queue honor? Splitting the queues like this can have some pretty awful effects on how ranking works. Perhaps something like separate ranks for premade and solo queue? Its kind of a tough question mostly because it never came up during vanillas lifespan and we all know how people feel about any change even if its overwhelmingly positive around here.
No i don’t have fun playing a small side game in classic that could easily be fixed by updating the matching system.
The sky must be falling because I actually agree with Ziryus on a topic.
Seriously though, the fact that the OP is being critical of casual pvpers is kinda hilarious.
this is not an argument
Simple minds resolve things in simple ways, who ties your shoes for you in the morning sir?
Certainly some premade groups were doing it. However, my experience was that most premade groups were just fine with 10 or so people tagging along. I only saw a few report-kicks and most of them were outside of AV premades, generally it was for someone who made an unpopular suggestion and the groupthink reacted badly to it.
It was a bad feature and highly-abusable, the fact that some premades used it was less of a premade issue and more of a issue with giving mobs that kind of power.
If you were in one of the premade discords, then you would have noticed that it was happening multiple times in any game that was full from the start, as not all people’s queues would pop for the same AV or at the same time.
Mass reporting (I think the threshold was as low as 3 [maybe 5]) was a way to ensure people in your premade would be able to get into your AV.
It was particularly prevalent during the first week (or couple of weeks) as the Alliance who are focused on PVP were grinding exalted rep, and with 7 minute games and insta-queues, it was good honor per hour.
wasn’t intended to be. there’s nothing to argue about.
if you dont like apple juice, dont drink apple juice
if you dont like classic, dont play classic.
theres no problem here that needs to be resolved.
you have the power to quit classic or not.
you have the power to join a premade or not.
if you have an issue, resolve it yourself.
Wow, some of these responses are way out there. People asking if I really thought this through. I did, and I am willing to wager your responses will age poorly.
I see a smattering of people already asking for additional changes to support a change that isn’t even made yet. All I can say to that is if you change needs additional changes to make it work, and those changes all look like what exists in retail… well I think you know what the next response is gonna be.
This is my favorite comment actually. I have used it many times, except I believe i referenced Lima beans because lets be honest. No reasonable person likes lima beans.
Not comparable.
What you’re saying would only be a problem if very few people played the game. But that’s simply not the case. Premades will always be more effective than randoms, even if those randoms are in superior gear.
Modern wow has given everyone everything. People want everything regardless. When people complain about Premades, its really just crying that they lost. They dont oppose premades as a rule, just as a vehicle that pits them against people better than them.
Lots of people cannot have fun in games unless they win. This is why some people cheat etc.
Except people aren’t complaining about losing, that has never been the complaint.
You are right, this isn’t about Pugs Vs Premades at all actually. I am trying to speak to the people who say they are “casual” pvpers and just want to “have fun.”
So, I am forecasting several months down the road and asking them how this all plays out. Will they still be having fun getting globalled? Do people not remember the burstiness of pvp in classic if they already havent seen it for themselves? Are people going to ask for resilience to be put on gear to compete with players decked out in Naxx gear?
By the responses I got you can see where the mindset is of some people:
Just an FYI, i get you are all sincere in your attempts to “fix” pvp. But most if not all of your suggestions were vetted, attempted, and failed. None of it worked in any version of the game.
Someone might claim ratings in arena but even then it was also about composition first, skill second.
Oh and uh this?
Thats a lie
And all of it worked. It simply depends on who you ask. There is no probable change or lack of change that everyone playing WoW could agree on.
One very real and sincere suggestion that I have (actually two) if people really want to “just play BGs” but insist on solo queuing, is:
Go play Retail. I actually doubt that anyone suggesting separating premades from pugs has actually played Retail. It’s a good game, and the exact experience you’re asking for is there.
The other suggestion is, if you insist on playing Classic and complaining about it, while asking for changes that exist in Retail, then play BGs in a lower level bracket. If that is your end game, it is pretty easy to level to 19 or 29 or 39. The queue times are good, the games are good.
You don’t have to twink, there are very few premade groups (sometimes there are), and the win/loss ratio seems quite even.
because it all lead to Warmode which everyone loved right?
I am not claiming that everyone loved anything. That is so far from being probable, that I would be confident to just call it impossible.
And that is my point. I’m actually not sure how you’ve interpreted what I’ve stated 
evidently not, otherwise you wouldn’t be posting. I’ll report you for trolling if you keep going, your post is just you asserting it’s the problem of a particular person, and so not a problem. once again, this is not an argument.
This is mysticism. Classic doesn’t exist in a vacuum, it is applied. This is why Blizzard already made changes to AV, past systems simply being implemented was not enough to create the classic experience. The same case is being made about premades and pugs.
This thinking does not address the argument, probably because you’re trolling. The point was the present system incentivizes premades avoiding each other and crushing pugs for quick and easy wins. Your logic only suggests everyone should do this to be happy, which is not an argument against criticizing this state of things first as a problem and second as not what vanilla was defined by.