no switching no take backs limit it make them live with their choices for ever.
The point would be our value of loyalty and role-playing.
We’d be those people who stay committed in relationships and marriages when we could be free to break-up and file for a divorce. We’d be those people that choose to work through our relationship for the long haul and would be hailed as unique and amazing on our 50 year anniversary.
We may be the minority - but there would be something very special about our choice.
So what would be wrong with my proposed compromise?
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With the restrictions this is 100% accurate. Because you’re restricted, and your loyalty doesn’t mean as much because your freedom to choose otherwise is suppressed.
I can guarante you I would never want to swap to another team if there wasn’t the stupidly varying class abilities completely unrelated to the team I would want to choose. You already told us that you don’t even care about the team theme/aesthetics/transmog, that you only care about the abilities. So why do you suddenly want team pride? Do you just want to be a part of any team no matter what?
My second point, how can you have pride and meaning behind loyalty if the loyalty is forced out of fear of negative consequences, not free will?
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Yes for member benefits in cosmetics and whatnot. Nay for extra power (though Mage Venthyr ability is pretty doodoo mechanically and could use a rework anyway).
Having extra power for remaining loyal isn’t really all that different from having a punishment for swapping, because the game would be tuned around the loyalty level of power.
I never said that. Theme is what I care about mist and that is represented by power.
No, I don’t understand actively wanting to force people into picking player power over literally any other aspect about Covenants that there may be to like, as a “punishment” for them enjoying the content they enjoy when it doesn’t harm you.
It’s not hard to say you’ll adapt fine when you don’t do content where your choice will matter, so claiming you’re automatically “better” than other people who find this system distasteful is a hilarious misrepresentation.
You’ve been given a clearly cut argument from me, yet refused to even acknowledge it.
The Covenants are being presented as these meaningful, overarching factions where you’ll need to pick one at the exclusion of the rest. The main things people associate with long-term faction investments are professions, transmog (to an extent), different slices of content, etc.
Instead, the primary draw of each Covenant is the abilities. You’re not allowed to test full Soulbind kits while leveling. You’re not allowed to try transmogs for Covenant Armor on your actual character while leveling, only in the dressing room. You’re not allowed to partake in Covenant-exclusive activities while leveling. The only portion of the overall “benefit” to being in a Covenant that you get to taste is the poorly balanced Covenant abilities.
So, at its core, the Covenant system is doing the following-
- Giving you factions of different ideologies to choose to represent
- Giving you associated benefits for joining a faction
- Tying a bulk of thise choice to an ability, which may be great or may be utter trash
So you’re left with…
- Choosing for theme and benefits
- Choosing for ability
There’s no part of this equation where your other factors outweigh the abilities unless you literally do content that is irrelevant, or simply doesn’t demand a degree of maximization that other content does.
I’m fine with you enjoying the content you consume. Let me enjoy the content I consume without this arbitrary restriction that contradicts both the overarching Shadowlands story, as well as the presented “freedom of choice”.
The idea us that the extra power justifies our choice to stay.
“I don’t want to go necrolord for this but my night fae ability is rank 5 so let’s just power through.”
I want power to be involved on some level.
But you did.
I said transmogs and mounts. You won’t find “theme” in that quote.
What’s fun for you may not be fun for others. You could pick a covenant, stick with it and be happy in YOUR choice. You can’t be happy unless everyone is locked? That seems extremely selfish.
So what happened to lore and story being important? Those would still be there without power attached to the Covenants.
Why? If you don’t like it, don’t do it. Everyone can have their fun.
Oh so you care about the ability and the color of the ability therefore locked covenants class abilities good? Isn’t the signature ability enough for you to represent your team theme or colors?
It’s just superficial if there is no team choice and were all just going to be all teams.
That’s the core of the argument for those supporting the current system.
Role-playing and meaningful choice arguments fall apart once you see how gameplay, story, and questing works in Shadowlands.
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Let me tell you a little something, a borrowed power system that will be put in the trash at the end of this expansion IS superficial.
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Not if I’m just going to have all four of them. I hate Necrolords but I’m gonna be forced to fire their colors from time to time if you guys got your way.
That’s the thing. The story basically has us on all teams, since every Covenant has one primary incentive for us to succeed regardless of our preferred Covenant- survival.
I don’t think I’ve seen any single person saying they’re better than the other on either side.
I’ve acknowledged it.
I don’t think anyone said it’s not a flawed concept. They’re just either for or against pulling the rip cord. The abilities are the focus, not most anything else.
The problem, as I’ve said, is a design philosphy here. Mine is this: I want permanence. If you are able to swap, that literally goes against permanence. I don’t care about the balance or anything like that. I want them to be permanent. An actual choice you have to make like your class choice, where you choose it and it’s done. There is no going back, none of that. You look and see what you want to do, pick it, then it’s done.
That’s my opinion and my viewpoint. Like I said, it is in the minority and it is a less desirable viewpoint by the #pulltheripcord people because it goes against their freedom in its entirety. Their freedom goes against my permanence in its entirety, too, thus why I said there is no middleground for this. The closest to a middleground I would actually enjoy is this: you choose a covenant, you swap, and either your ability to choose another covenant or your ability to swap back goes on a CD. It will either be 3 days or 5 days of a CD, but it’s a CD. I don’t like wishy washy crap and that’s exactly what that freedom represents.