Iām going to go ahead and put my no vote in the ballot box 
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Thereās still plenty of weird loot, though. Iām sorry if a deeper understanding of the game becoming more widespread spoiled your fun.
The game has only become more dynamic, though? What youāre saying doesnāt really make sense, and itās almost like youāre parroting the opinions of another that you donāt fully comprehend.
[quote=āNorinila-moon-guard, post:1, topic:1171485, full:trueā]
many things in game contribute to and enable this toxicity like gear score and item levels
and other rating systems dps meters also and i think it would be a good time to consider getting rid of these things. as it was in the beginning of wow we had none of this and the attitude and community was so much better
[/quote] {Edited for spelling}
I get what youāre saying. I do. I think the biggest offender is raider i.o. - BUT it comes down to people. Reading through this thread I could see the people that got it and those that didnāt.
Getting rid of them wonāt change people. Getting rid of them wonāt change how the game is insanely working for the people who participate in high-end content. Which Neralya elucidates.
yes it does
Competition is extreme. Some players are looking for the best of the best for a reason.
Example:
Then thereās people like me. Iām not ashamed to admit that Iām not some killer player. Iām not.
But then you see this:
It isnāt. He/she/Joy/smile is right. And I donāt want to be in a group that wants/needs an expert and screw up their run. It may not feel like a fair race, but itās not viable.
And you have to take into account that no one is on equal footing.
Iām not entirely sure the first part of this is true for some players. I use my damage meter for me, but I know others also use it for āmeā - and Iāve seen players kicked on a silly heroic dungeon because of that damage meter.
The last part, for better or worse, are the people I count on or hope for when I try a dungeon. If not for those better players I wouldnāt learn some key elements. The only hard thing is letting others see that Iām not the No. 1 great player that manages everything, does it all perfect, and never steps in a bad spot.
I do hate the no talking, just take off. I hate wasting an interrupt! lol
Exactly.
Yep. That would help immensely, but also rather than that focus on the āhelpingā so the idjit gets the picture he/she is being ignored. But helping has to get frustrating too.
Sometimes the longer a dungeon is and I keep making the same damn mistake Iām really surprised when I donāt get the kick! People have varying degrees of patience and skill on any given day. Most people help or at the very least tolerate the medium player.
Iāll finish with one thing. I hate being called unskilled dweeb or whatever it is that some spew about players that are just good. Doesnāt mean I donāt work to get better, doesnāt mean I donāt have any skill whatsoever. Just means Iām not Wonder Woman - or Gal Gadot. 
Iāve read more kind players in this thread than the opposite. Thatās who were really playing with rather than these āelitist.ā Two different agendaās who use those add-ons for two different reasons. If itās for the high-end pusher I donāt belong there anyway.
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In the beginning wow was so easy that you didnāt need good performance to do things.
Also, I check your armory and you donāt do anything that has rating so why does this matter to you?
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Elitism sounds negative and condescending. Players that want to play the best they can and build groups that they think will play as good as them to succeed is not a bad thing. Players that want to push themselves is great, thatās the kind of person that has drive and others to ālook up toā sort of speak.
Just in real life. Are people that work hard through school and successfully earn a good career elitists? No, they are role models.
I know WoW is not real life of course, but doing well should never be looked down on in any scenario.
If a player doesnāt want to play to improve then that is fine. Have fun the way you want, but donāt try to knock others down.
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You will probably have to put together your own PUGs if you want to screen for what you want. Your descriptors should be explicit using keywords like ācasualā and āprogressionā or āsocialā. Right now, the PUG scene at higher difficulties is predominantly comprised of more competitive people, itās kind of a natural fit. And as difficulties rise, so do frustrations and vents from those experiencing such.
Based on on how and what many of the game guides focus on, I do kind of agree the game kind of leans towards min/max gameplay. Leveraging the desire of competitive people to be the best. They donāt call it World of Warcrack for nothing. I hear the RP scene in this game keeps shrinking, and Iām guessing itās because those people are finding better alternatives via VR and whatnot. I wouldnāt mind there to be an āAdventure Modeā where gear is less emphasized, flying doesnāt exist, pushover mobs donāt exist, itās challenging to traverse anywhere you go, and everything is a single difficulty.
Yes, and such difficulties still exist today, but people also have the option of doing harder difficulties, which, as you might imagine, benefit from additional effort.
Nothing is stopping OP from making their own group of buddies to run mythic dungeons with, or heroic ones. Adventure, go at their own pace, etc.
This whole thing is a non-issue.
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but its a false understanding in many ways big numbers are not always the way to measure success.
How would you know, though?
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what even is āelitismā anyway? OP you didnāt really give your definitionā¦
rating systems existed in the early versions of wow, and so did the same attitudes. 
OP getting declined, I think.
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You donāt need gearscore to know who is and who isnāt geared well. We did just fine knowing such in BC before such existed.
No it wasnāt. The community is pretty similar except for the fact that folks are used to a lobby based game structure vs. open world now.
If you want to avoid āElitismā then join a guild or make some friends.
And your way, if you join a group and have an off run, you name would go on the ādo not group withā list, just like in the beginning.
With ilvl, scoring, and meters, one off run doesnāt hurt your reputation as bad.
You will always be classed, and thatās not the game, itās the player base, and they will always find a way.
I enjoy having a dps meter. I am no where near a top player but having a range for the dps I need to be at in order to not drag my raid mates down really helped. When you are playing the game alone it really does not mater your dps as you as you killing things before they kill you. But when going into group play that is not the case, you owe it to the people you play with to play at your best.
Sometimes your best is not going to be good enough and you need to improve if you want to do group play. Now you may find a group where the dps does not matter but eventually if you want to progress it does matter. Meters are a tool, it is the community that takes that tool and ruins it. If your numbers are low, then improve yourself donāt try to get rid of the meters. People will still find out the problem is you not pulling enough damage.
because i played the game for 15 years and i have been every kind of player and played every roll.
like when my classic guild tryed to replace me with a paladin because his healing was higher and it was. but the mechanics of having a hot class was much more necessary and they hit a brick wall with out me
so that would be one example on why itās bad and toxic and false
Iāll only add I do think that the game caters much more to āelitistā players than casuals. Thereās just so much more for them to do, rewards to achieve, gear to pwn with.
Casuals are basically relegated to LFR, Korthia and random BGs.
Oh, there is one more group the game caters toā¦ the rich. If you got cash and can buy a bunch of gold with tokens you can pay others to get you all those sweet rewards and gear.
Then play with people that want to play with you.
Use the tools available to improve.
You donāt become a better player just because others canāt see it on a meter.
That is a choice to only participate in that content. There should be more to obtain for different and bigger accomplishments.
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As somebody whoās run a Cutting Edge raiding guild for many years, now, threads like this are so strange to me.
If somebody wants to join our team, I donāt give a damn what their current gear is like. Gear is incredibly easy to get.
What I DO care about are their logs, their progression history and accomplishments, and having a long talk with them to see if theyāre going to mesh well with the team in terms of both personality and play style.
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Brewa spitting 
.
You canāt remove the competitive features of the game without turning it into a different game, a game that it never was.
There was a time individually when you didnāt know about endgame and everything was new, but thatās passed. Thatās not on the game, youāve just experienced it already. The first time you go to Vegas, you try stuff out. The second time, you bring an itinerary. Thatās in game and real life.
The feeling OP wants doesnāt exist anymore, because it was a state they were in for a moment in time. Youāll never recapture it.
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I wasnāt speaking about myself. I do raid normal and a little heroic. Got my Torgast achievements solo, etc.
You donāt have to be a person to defend them.