@Byucknah
Thank you very much for this post. As this is the allied race concept that creates the most buzz, it's important to remain civil not just to represent your side well, but to treat your fellow gamers with respect
@Everyone
I don't harbor any ill feelings towards any of you. Be you pro or against High Elves, Horde or Alliance, either way we're all just a bunch of nerds who love WoW. I understand this is a topic we're all passionate about (Lord knows I'm passionate about High Elves), but we're adults, and as such should strive to remain civil for the sake of constructive conversation
10/09/2018 04:03 AMPosted by TyrandiaWhy not room for both the mage and ranger type cultures? The Draenei do it well with their arcanists and Rangari. As for their AR mount, we donât need any more horses thatâs for sure. Maybe bears from the hinterlands as their mount?
My point is that it's difficult to find an animal, not heretofore chosen, which captures both these elements symbolically. The challenge is finding the correct forms to convey this. But you're absolutely right that the flavor you suggest is wonderful.
Aren't bears a bit brawn-force for a High Elf? Certainly it'd make a statement.
10/09/2018 04:02 AMPosted by GulrumI suggested modeling them on Tolkien's Rivendell elves, who live in lodges in the wilds but are also wise loremasters at the same time. And those lodges are quite the ornate structures in their own right, nothing to scoff at for any elf.
Plus Elrond had control over the river's waters with his ring, giving credence to the idea of a High Elf shaman that uses artifacts of great power to control the elements.
If druids won't work for any of a myriad of potential reasons, this idea has my complete support.
I'm leveling a Void Elf for the Heritage armor and been running around Old Dalaran and it's maddening seeing all the Helfs, wanting to play one, not being able to as I level up the compromise.
Why exactly can we have alternate universe Orcs but we can't have High Elves?
#rhetorical
Why exactly can we have alternate universe Orcs but we can't have High Elves?
#rhetorical
Still here, still wanting High Elves
But I am against shamans on the basis they've never had anything to do with shamans. High Elves aren't an unknown quantity you can do that with, and one of the big aspects people are for them is the history. Yes they were pals with the Wildhammer, but their flavour of magic has always been different. Wildhammers being shamans was their big unusual thing
Druids? Sure, that fits. But shamans is a bit far of a stretch for me
But I am against shamans on the basis they've never had anything to do with shamans. High Elves aren't an unknown quantity you can do that with, and one of the big aspects people are for them is the history. Yes they were pals with the Wildhammer, but their flavour of magic has always been different. Wildhammers being shamans was their big unusual thing
Druids? Sure, that fits. But shamans is a bit far of a stretch for me
10/09/2018 04:08 AMPosted by Tomlyn10/09/2018 04:03 AMPosted by TyrandiaWhy not room for both the mage and ranger type cultures? The Draenei do it well with their arcanists and Rangari. As for their AR mount, we donât need any more horses thatâs for sure. Maybe bears from the hinterlands as their mount?
My point is that it's difficult to find an animal, not heretofore chosen, which captures both these elements symbolically. The challenge is finding the correct forms to convey this. But you're absolutely right that the flavor you suggest is wonderful.
Aren't bears a bit brawn-force for a High Elf? Certainly it'd make a statement.10/09/2018 04:02 AMPosted by GulrumI suggested modeling them on Tolkien's Rivendell elves, who live in lodges in the wilds but are also wise loremasters at the same time. And those lodges are quite the ornate structures in their own right, nothing to scoff at for any elf.
Plus Elrond had control over the river's waters with his ring, giving credence to the idea of a High Elf shaman that uses artifacts of great power to control the elements.
If druids won't work for any of a myriad of potential reasons, this idea has my complete support.
You know, I agree the bears might be a little out of character. I think a fox mount would actually be perfect for the balance of mage and ranger. Smart, agile and cunning. For the fox mount maybe draped with cloth and leather looks, no plate.
1 Like
Good morning everyone! A big thank you to Byucknah for reminding us all to keep this thread and discussion in a respectful and constructive place. ^^
On the topic of racials I've been thinking but man I love the one someone mentioned about keeping your food buff after you die.
Just spitballing here but something neat would be some form of stealth reveal maybe. Unsure if it would work but say they focus themselves and can see stealthed targets in a smaller area around them for a shorter duration. Thinking out loud it sounds a lot like spectral sight but the range would be smaller, cd around 2-3 minutes and you can still use your abilities while the effect is active with a shorter duration than spectral sight.
Again idk how well this would work in practice but this is the kind of stuff I like to see in our megathread. At the very least it's constructive and not feeding the trolls.
Will be thinking of more while I'm at work. Planning to check back when I can!
On the topic of racials I've been thinking but man I love the one someone mentioned about keeping your food buff after you die.
Just spitballing here but something neat would be some form of stealth reveal maybe. Unsure if it would work but say they focus themselves and can see stealthed targets in a smaller area around them for a shorter duration. Thinking out loud it sounds a lot like spectral sight but the range would be smaller, cd around 2-3 minutes and you can still use your abilities while the effect is active with a shorter duration than spectral sight.
Again idk how well this would work in practice but this is the kind of stuff I like to see in our megathread. At the very least it's constructive and not feeding the trolls.
Will be thinking of more while I'm at work. Planning to check back when I can!
1 Like
Also I would really love to see ideas for heritage armor if anyone has any fan made stuff laying around!
10/09/2018 04:36 AMPosted by SafanaAlso I would really love to see ideas for heritage armor if anyone has any fan made stuff laying around!
On our Tumblr page you can find out some concepts - including heritage armour. Such as: https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/174256227289/heritage-armor-art-concept-ranger-general-armor
https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/172028746239/high-elf-heritage-armor-version-31-by-jokubas
And
https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/172079924444/ramavatarama-with-this-beautiful-alleria
Note, there are others though xD.
Hope you like them!
1 Like
10/09/2018 04:35 AMPosted by SafanaGood morning everyone! A big thank you to Byucknah for reminding us all to keep this thread and discussion in a respectful and constructive place. ^^
On the topic of racials I've been thinking but man I love the one someone mentioned about keeping your food buff after you die.
Just spitballing here but something neat would be some form of stealth reveal maybe. Unsure if it would work but say they focus themselves and can see stealthed targets in a smaller area around them for a shorter duration. Thinking out loud it sounds a lot like spectral sight but the range would be smaller, cd around 2-3 minutes and you can still use your abilities while the effect is active with a shorter duration than spectral sight.
Again idk how well this would work in practice but this is the kind of stuff I like to see in our megathread. At the very least it's constructive and not feeding the trolls.
Will be thinking of more while I'm at work. Planning to check back when I can!
What's hilarious about the idea of giving helfs a stealth reveal is that it's so quintessentially nightborne that it would probably be too much of a kick in the face for them. It would have been amazing if when a nightborne used that kind of racial they'd yell out something like
"Something's not quite right..."
1 Like
10/09/2018 05:08 AMPosted by Xyaa10/09/2018 04:36 AMPosted by SafanaAlso I would really love to see ideas for heritage armor if anyone has any fan made stuff laying around!
On our Tumblr page you can find out some concepts - including heritage armour. Such as: https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/174256227289/heritage-armor-art-concept-ranger-general-armor
https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/172028746239/high-elf-heritage-armor-version-31-by-jokubas
And
https://legacyofqt.tumblr.com/post/172079924444/ramavatarama-with-this-beautiful-alleria
Note, there are others though xD.
Hope you like them!
That third link is amazing, simple and awesome. I like the regular leather and how it all varies and isnât just one straight color. A variation of what alleria has and the eagletalon set (not a copy of it) would be a versatile for any class of High elf.
2 Likes
Now that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
10/09/2018 03:55 AMPosted by TomlynA conventional cat, dignified, yet still an adroit hunting predator, with silver mana-infusion, does this; but we already have NE -- so a cat would need meaningful differentiation, probably beyond an arcane sheen. Especially since manasaber are associated with the Nightborne.
I personally like a good old fashioned Lynx as far as their cat form would go. I always pictured red and gold colors for Blood Elves back when I lobbied for them. Instead, I could see silver, light blonde and earthy more natural colors for a High Elven cat form.
Aside from those, I could see them with Owlcats or maybe Wolfhawks, the latter serving as both their cat form and applicable travel forms. I don't mind foxes either.
I like both Dragonhawk and Hippogryph for their flight forms.
Other than that I'd be happy with somewhat traditional forms if they had Druids.
10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
I love these, and prefer them to any other option myself tbh. It's a new spin on the races representation and even has precedence with similar models used prior by old High Elf npcs and early BC Blood Elf models.
10/09/2018 04:36 AMPosted by SafanaAlso I would really love to see ideas for heritage armor if anyone has any fan made stuff laying around!
It's pretty much what Blizzard will reveal for ours during the 8.1 heritage scenario. Void elves got theirs and are what the Alliance are getting in terms of high elves and the Horde already has the main contingent. We even have the scenario showcasing it.
Seems quite unlikely that they'll go, man let's show that heritage twice....oh wait they went Horde and the Alliance already has the version we made for them so they wouldn't have a carbon copy race. It's almost as if... that was the point?
10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
They still look like blood elves to me. Only difference is their posture and blue eyes. Having customizations would need to be significant to make them unique. Then You just fall into the realm of void elves. I gave it a good look, I promise. Honestly, there is no way Blizzard would go for it. They are too similar. You are better off asking to get void elf white skin options.
Ugh... how can you guys not see this?
10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
They still look like blood elves to me. Only difference is their posture and blue eyes. Having customizations would need to be significant to make them unique. Then You just fall into the realm of void elves.
Ugh... how can you guys not see this?
Of course they look like Blood Elves, they are the same biologically speaking. The point here is to put effort into how to make them look different without breaking the fact that they are a similar group of people
If they had different body proportions, animations, skin tones, hair styles, voices, and of course their signature eye color, wouldn't that make them different enough so as to not offend Horde Blood Elf players? We aren't trying to steal Blood Elves as a race, we just want the race of thalassian Quel'dorei High Elves who are allied to the Alliance to be playable
10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
I like the skin colors, I like the hairstyles and the tattoos (would love more of those to be visible). As for the models, while I'd accept them if it meant playable High Elves, I have to admit that I'm not crazy, knowing where they come from (mostly Night Elves). We've got enough re-use of the Night Elf skeleton through the Zandalari and the Nightborne.
My biggest concern is any model that Blood Elf players might see as objectively better would be cause for a massive flame war on the forums. Any model that is objectively worse would likewise be seen as, 'Blizzard sabotaging Alliance requests, AGAIN, to mollify their precious Horde.'
Much as I hate to say it, it seems the most prudent course would be to use the existing models. Less work as well if we're honest.
10/09/2018 06:04 AMPosted by Harlequin10/09/2018 04:36 AMPosted by SafanaAlso I would really love to see ideas for heritage armor if anyone has any fan made stuff laying around!
It's pretty much what Blizzard will reveal for ours during the 8.1 heritage scenario. Void elves got theirs and are what the Alliance are getting in terms of high elves and the Horde already has the main contingent. We even have the scenario showcasing it.
Seems quite unlikely that they'll go, man let's show that heritage twice....oh wait they went Horde and the Alliance already has the version we made for them so they wouldn't have a carbon copy race. It's almost as if... that was the point?
Should High Elves get added they obviously wouldn't go with a theme related to Blood Elves, seeing as they've lost that part of their culture. Lore wise it's even been stated that Alliance High Elves make an effort to not wear red to avoid being seen as a Blood Elf
10/08/2018 07:12 AMPosted by Fliktarg...
Ironic much?
Not really. The difference is your arguments are disproven while ours still stand strong and true. You don't change your arguments and points when they are true.
Except... ya know... Blizz seems to think otherwise. There's that.
I think the Human frame would work great for the Male HE, but I think the Female should utilize the model of alexstrasza, the human female frame isnât ideal, mainly because the animations arenât well developed and a little clumsy at times.10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
10/09/2018 06:19 AMPosted by Alurna10/09/2018 05:48 AMPosted by LorithynNow that we're back on topic, I'd like everyone, pro and against, to look at the following models and discuss whether they or something similar would be an acceptable compromise for High Elves;
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329725237438578688/497559136259801088/HighElfMockup.jpg
I've been posting these everywhere, I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record. If given a different model with new customization options, as well as having different class access to Blood Elves, this is imo one of the better compromises
I like the skin colors, I like the hairstyles and the tattoos (would love more of those to be visible). As for the models, while I'd accept them if it meant playable High Elves, I have to admit that I'm not crazy, knowing where they come from (mostly Night Elves). We've got enough re-use of the Night Elf skeleton through the Zandalari and the Nightborne.
My biggest concern is any model that Blood Elf players might see as objectively better would be cause for a massive flame war on the forums. Any model that is objectively worse would likewise be seen as, 'Blizzard sabotaging Alliance requests, AGAIN, to mollify their precious Horde.'
Much as I hate to say it, it seems the most prudent course would be to use the existing models. Less work as well if we're honest.
You do bring up good points... There's a fine line between, "Their model is better than ours" and "Our model isn't good enough." I'm hoping that a compromise like this would be objective, and would carry person to person as to which one they'd prefer
And while these may be based on Night Elf models, I take comfort in knowing that it wouldn't mean they're stuck with the horrible Night Elf animations (looking at you, forehead casting). Its possible to have a body rig run the animations of other races