I know the whole meme, yadda yadda “Blizz should hire us” stuff, whatever, it won’t happen and I do not think I would ever go to California to work.
But man. Just steal this idea, give us some free mounts and named NPCs in recognition and implement this already, because I think you and I just fixed leveling.
Give me a Chicago or MKE Blizzard office and I’d leave my cushy/safe public sector job.
I guess if you can’t come up with a real argument, attacking the players is easy…
There is an article on the ad-hominem fallacy in wikipedia…
I don’t care what the old folks told about the Blood Elves back in the day. But given how humans with pointy ears and Barbie doll hourglass figure dominate the overall player’s choice, it’s a question why this actually happened. Wasn’t the Blood Elf racial busted back in the day?
It’s about equality. If the developer can’t manage both sides at the same time, then it’s simply a double standard. The most popular requests were pretty much known ever since Legion.
There were actual two death blows, which caused a massive player exodus. The removal of Pathfinder and SL, including the lawsuit. The game declines over the years, yes, but these two events truly caused a massive storm.
But it snowballed regardless, hasn’t it. And that’s the problem on the situation. The Alliance racials are just OP now because nobody cared to play them back, when there was still time to undo the faction swapping.
Void Elves are somewhat accepted, but not what people actually wanted. We will see what they will do in Midnight about this fiasco. The biggest issue Void Elves have is the sheer insincerity coming from the developers. The Alliance can’t have their Silver Covenant elves but 5-10 corrupted elves in a building makes a race now?
“Hey, look, I’m posting here to get your attention, give me your acknowledgement now or I’ll start to mirror everything you said!”
Blast there is seemingly allergic to the words “in my opinion” major problem with believing she knows all things.
When someone starts blaming the players for decisions that the devs made, you know they lost touch and should probably take a break from the game
No, there weren’t. You do know what a death blow is, right? Something that actually kills you?
WoW is not only not dead, it is by most metrics back on the rise. Sure, it’ll never come anywhere near it’s old peak; no MMO is ever likely to become a phenominon quite like that. But all signs point to WoW not only not being dead, but with plenty of life left in it.
The fact you think the removal of pathfinder negatively impacted the game though, and qualifies as a deathblow? That’s funny. Because Pathfinder itself is pretty new, and was widely disliked. Disliked enough that they went and nerfed the requirements every expansion. There was no massive storm about it’s removal. It was a handful of tryhards.
This sounds so disingenuous. No, your argument has not been about equality.
First it was that blood elves “ruined” the Horde, but also brought more people over to the Horde, while also acknowledging the Horde was much smaller than the Alliance. If you were mad about inequality this whole time, you wouldn’t complain that Blizzard made a choice to try and remedy an inequality from as early as TBC.
Then it was about Horde always getting races they want (wrong, no ogres) which… Flies in the face of your previous argument nobody wanted blood elves, but whatever. And the Alliance never getting races they want. Except the only race that people had been demanding we get for Hordeside that we actually got were goblins. And they proved so popular that most stat sites place them as the third least played race Hordeside, so I don’t know how wanted they were in the first place. Other than goblins, there hasn’t been any high demand for any of the races we all have gotten, so this entire argument is moot.
But no, now it’s about something else entirely. Now it’s about equality of racial abilities.
Okay.
Horde ogres have been a request since Vanilla. Alliance high elves have been a request since also still Vanilla, but really picked up steam since TBC.
Pointing at Legion as the start point is not only wrong, it’s a pretty weird point in time to pick regardless.
I never blamed the user but the developers. The topic still revolves around “human fatigue” and this also includes Blood Elves and why they aren’t the focus. And Blood Elves are just humans with barbie doll figures bodies and pointy ears. Given, that everyone always yells “I don’t wanna play these monkey on steroids”, it not only shows that the model distribution was successful for the Horde but also a problem in the long run for the health of the game.
Let’s put this in perspective:
https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/3cweto/wow_subscriber_graph_from_200515/
The game took a big blow in WoD for two reasons: Pathfinder and lack of content. If you have been playing back then, you know how controversial Pathfinder was and Blizzard was forced to justify their situation. It didn’t help that the game also got its infamous selfie-feature. WoD was the first actual death blow to the numbers and it hasn’t recovered since then apparently. I’m correct here.
Highmountain Tauren? Zandalari Trolls? Nightborne? Up-right Orcs? Vulpera?
No, it’s not. John Hight went into detail how races are picked during the development of Legion. This was the time when they actively added requested races into the game.
ya that i understand, i just miss understood what you were saying
The problem with making up your argument on the fly is that you quickly forget what you previously argued. You very clearly did not point to the inclusion of pathfinder as a problem. you labelled it’s removal as the problem.
You might want to try and pay better attention to your own points so you stop contradicting them.
Purely speculative, and flies in the face of the fact every expansion after that broke sales records. If we go with third party sources (which admittedly are of dubious value), Legion marked a very strong recovery and carried into BfA. Shadowlands and Dragonflight didn’t reach Legion/BfA levels, but still were outperforming WoD.
But sure. Ten years ago the game died.
There was no demand for a new race, only customization options.
There was no demand because nobody knew they would even be a thing until they were announced as an upcoming allied race in the new expansion.
Nobody wanted them, nor do they now.
Customization options are not races.
Small demand.
Ok, so the game has included ogres, naga and high elves already, just nobody else can see them. We certainly didn’t get Discount Night Elves and Chunky Humans instead of anything people actually demanded and have continued to demand for well over a decade.
Horde players really wanted Scuffed Night Elves and not Ogres.
You are literally just trolling.
Yes, this was a mistake. But you luckily know what I’m talking about. I have been trying to get into the void state the past days and it took a toll on my sleeping pattern. Let’s continue.
Do we have numbers for this?
That’s just a blurred line argument. If we go back and read posts from 2016, things look far more differently.
The Nightborne and Kul Tiran were extremely requested races. This is evident if you look back at topics and postings made on the internet. What broke the camel’s back was the Vulpera-incident on wowhead and the datamined brewfestival changes. Nobody wanted Mechagnomes. HMT was also fairly requested from the Alliance but nobody really wished for Lightforged to become a thing. And the Void Elves were popular but deeply despised and even featured in an online magazine how things went wrong with them.
I have no time for trolling. I’m having a discussion here with you and if you just want to cut it off, then do so. Nobody cares for either you or me in the grand schemes of the anonymous internet, so do as it pleases you.
As I said, we only have 3rd party sources.
https://www.gamechampions.com/en/blog/world-of-warcraft-player-count-in-2023/
An estimated 5.6 currently, at the end of Dragonflight’s life.
Blizzard’s last reported figure for WoD was 5.5, also around the end of its life.
I was around back then. Zandalari trolls and vulpera certainly were not a high-demand race and one did not exist.
Highmountain tauren were, as I said, asked for as a customization option.
Nobody asked for Scuffed Night Elves for the Horde. If you think they were asked for, you’ll need to provide any proof of that.
Oh, I wish that were the case. But no, you’re not.
You started this off making baseless claims that blood elves ruined the Horde Feel, then kept shifting your argument thereafter.
It’s about Alliance not getting their most demanded races.
Really, it’s about how human-ish races have ruined the game.
It’s really about imbalanced racials.
Actually the game is officially dead, and BfA killed it.
Actually Shadowlands killed it.
Actually WoD killed it.
Blizzard gave only the most highly demanded races, like… Glow-in-the-Dark Drainos and Scuffed Night Elves.
Kul Tirans were extremely demanded, and Alliance got them. Thus negating your own initial argument.
We’re not having a discussion, because you don’t know what you want to discuss, and you make very bold claims like Horde players demanded Highmountain Tauren in spite of them being in the bottom 3 in popularity, barely edging out Pandas and Dracthyr.
https://www.dataforazeroth.com/stats/races
Fun fact; For Horde-side, the first five races are all clearly very popular. Goblins have less than half the population of the least popular BC-era race (forsaken), get beaten out by two Allied races, and were actually a frequently requested race during Vanilla.
Kul tirans? That highly demanded race?
Less popular than Glow Drainos.
And before you want to blame unlock requirements? Zanda trolls, their equivalent, are the Horde’s most popular Allied race and are second overall only to void elves.
Scuffed Night Elves are in the middle among Allied Race popularity Horde-side. Not quite so highly demanded.
But at least we can all agree nobody liked Mechagnomes.
I’ll give this to you. Apparently the game stagnated somewhere around 5-6 million users per expansion.
ZT existed back in the day on the old forums. And for Vulpera we have several topics even in the mega topic listed, back in the day, when they weren’t playable. Vulpera had a LOT of people rallying for them. To put it in context from the topic:
Another thread about the foxes?
I googled around 2016 and the most discussions are not available anymore (apparently they were on the old forums) but MMO champion has several topics on it, including reddit. Nightborne were surely asked to become playable. There is also a bigger number of one-shot topics, like these one. So, yes, they were contested.
Sounds absolutely right and on point to me. The issue is certainly multi-faceted and yes, the Kul Tiran one is a weird example looking back (not my posting). They were in demand, Blizzard even stated that they took more work to get done and yet they are also unpopular.
These were the topics back then. And you were also wrong with the Vulpera, perhaps your memory is bit blurry here. I do remember HMT and Nightborne discussion extremely debated, because how much everyone wanted to mirror the faction races back in the day. I’ll look over the next few days if I can find these topics somewhere.
The graph also shows that ZT and Vulpera are very popular races, hence my argumentation that they were also often requested back in the day. Especially ZT since MoP.
If your best example of people clamouring for Playable Vulpira is a thread made after the full suite of customization options Vulpira NPCs already had was widely known and even addressed in the first post of the topic…
I don’t really think we’re using the same definition of “high demand”. I don’t use “highly demanded” as a synonym for “clearly already the plan by the time we learned they had models”.
Within that very same topic, there two people asking for playable Nightborne, then a gap until playable nightborne were a thing.
You’re doing very poorly with evidence so far.
Or maybe you’re confusing “highly demanded” with “well, clearly we’re already getting them and it was the plan from the start”. By the time we learned Vulpira even existed, model work to make them playable had already begun.
That is not giving us a highly demanded race by any reasonable measure.
Ity isn’t my memory that’s the issue here.
I never disputed they’re popular. I’m disputing there has always been a high demand for them that Blizzard caved to.
It’s not possible with Vulpira; again, they cannot be giving in to a high demand if they planned for them to be playable before we knew they exist. That doesn’t even make sense.
Zanda trolls were not a highly demanded race. Was there some demand? Sure. More was aimed at giving Darkspear trolls better customization options, but at this point, I just do not care anymore. Let’s just pretend you’re right.
Sorry, it’s all I got to add.
I shall accept it because I’m doing the worgo heritage quest right now.
And yet there was no guarantee they will become playable. Remind me, does this not also applies to other races which aren’t playable? Sethrak do have a Heart of Azeroth animation, no?
https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/8c5nyj/sethrak_playability_10_custom_artoffloop_animation/
The truth might be somewhere in the middle. The developers went back to add the Hearth of Azeroth animation to older races, so they can become perhaps a player race at one point.
You’re just dismissive and that’s okay. It’s one of your personal traits as human being.
What most people forget is that all of the polygon models come with animations, which are based on already existing character models. Where is your proof that the developers planned them from the very start?
They were in demand. I do remember the discussions about them and their backs, which includes the Darkspear Trolls. Unfortunately for both of us we have no access to the old forums anymore. I still don’t understand why they had to wipe it completely clean back then.
[quote=“Blastkrizzle-wyrmrest-accord, post:439, topic:1749604”]
And yet there was no guarantee they will become playable. Remind me, does this not also applies to other races which aren’t playable? Sethrak do have a Heart of Azeroth animation, no? [/quote]
You’re really comparing “has an animation” to “is fully designed from the ground up with the full suite of customizations and animations”?
You are unserious.
It’s a 12 response thread, more than half of which came post-playable Nightborne, and a thread that fully already acknowledges vulpira have been designed to become playable.
I’m not being dismissive. I’m being realistic.
Most models have a very limited selection of animations, limited customization options and built-in base outfits of some degree.
Vulpira did not. Vulpira were designed with all the details a playable race would be designed with, which no non-playable race has to this very day been given.
Ok.
You’re forgetting that most of the animations on the new models are based on something before.
This wasn’t sure back in the day. The real first indicator was the datamined graphical changes from the brewfest. If we go by your logic, then Gilgoblins are also already a race they designed to become playable.
They are a Goblin-spinoff, where they took the groundwork and rolled with it. We can also bring this argument to any similar looking race (Frostdwarfs, Taunka, …) and how they are already “fit” for a player race. The only big difference between the Vulpera and other models is that they redesigned the look of the character, so it doesn’t look like a Goblin.
Given that most races are based on another race, the argument falls flat over time. Apparently the Kul Tiran were the exception to the norm, although I still find this hard to believe.
I’m not.
It was all mentioned in that thread, so yes.
Funnily enough, neither of them have the full animation suites, so no.