Combat Rogue was actually good.
If you get giddy rolling dice, go play Dungeons and Dragons. At least in that game, most of your re-rolls won’t suck.
5 Likes
Outlaw Rogue APM spec could be fixed with one simple damage buff. I also assume you PVE. It’s fun playing off every single roll the bones you get in PvP scenarios.
I like Outlaw. I like Combat. I’d like to see the best of both come together to make something grand.
5 Likes
Why on Earth would anyone play Outlaw in PvP?
2 Likes
I do. It’s fun making it work. Just put on Guile’s theme and let it rip.
Incredibly satisfying when you thrash a 3 button zug spec with your 70 APM mediocre spec.
3 Likes
Why on Earth would anyone PVE when it doesn’t reward you anything?
2 Likes
What? Combo points don’t keep you in combat. I stealth around all the time holding a few cp’s.
2 Likes
Remember that to this day, we unlock new guns and bows appearences, when we picking one up. It would be something more than natural to let Rogue to customize the weapon he/she throws, picking one from all the ranged weapons beeing released so far, and adding new ones, like shurikens, to matching fantasy of our class (in every spec).
I think this might be the case, when Blizz decide to refresh quality of life changes to Rogue - they want us to pickpocket people and get something extra, so they could make our ranged weapons visible again, when pressing ranged attack button.
3 Likes
Coming from the perspective of being an Outlaw one-trick with a sole focus on PvE, this is my personal wishlist
Class talent tree - The current class talent tree’s layout is super boring and extremely restrictive. There’s virtually no room to take anything extra quality-of-life or utility wise as the talent tree is bloated to the brim with DPS talents which either cause you to lose multiple percents worth of sim DPS or messing the gameplay feel entirely just for taking out a single point. Would really like to see boring passives like things like lethality or thief’s versatility being either baseline or removed outright, as well a grand pathing update to actually allow for variance in talent pathing between builds without kind of gutting your damage.
Buff Ace Up Your Sleeve - Combo Point refund whenever you hit BtE sounds extremely fun, especially considering you’re sending it on CD (with the exception of if you have a Greenskin’s buff already up) but currently with the current numericals tied to it (20% chance for 4 CP) it’s currently a talent that’s destined to be dead in the water the entire expansion unless it sees some good tweaking. My idea could possibly be 50% for full combo, like a different kind of Marked For Death, but it’s totally possible that could be a bit much. Preferably tweak the percentages rather than giving anything less than full combo, as anything less would just feel awkward with how much combo Outlaw already generates right now across Dreadblades, Hidden Opp, and Fan the Hammer.
Bring back Marked For Death - While sure it’s currently still in the class tree, it needs to not compete with Deeper Stratagem and also be updated to accomodate the six (Assa / Sub) or seven (Outlaw) Combo Points you now have, rather than generating just five. Currently not a single spec plays this button in any PvE scenario and in recent years the only spec to get any real steam from it has been Outlaw, with it being reduced by Restless Blades. If it feels like it doesn’t fit on the class tree anymore, maybe just make it an Outlaw talent and have it replace one of the useless talents that are in the tree such as Triple Threat, Riposte, or even Sleight of Hand (As Sleight’s value is basically null when up against Loaded Dice, which is just Sleight but significantly better), could also even replace something boring like Ambidexterity.
Remove Triple Threat - Triple Threat as it stands is quite literally a useless talent which currently serves the sole purpose of being a two point wall to the Hidden Opportunity side of the tree (Or a wall to Ghostly Strike if you play Keep it Rolling), when spec’d into Hidden Opp, this talent currently will genuinely never do more than 0.1% of your damage as represented by WarcraftLogs and Details, and when using it with KIR it’s still abbhorrently weak, especially as a two pointer. You simply just take it due to how strong Ghostly Strike is in Single Target for Keep it Rolling. It’s the most boring talent on the tree and is numerically useless. Please scrap it.
Make Acrobatic Strikes baseline - If anything is to be made baseline for Rogues it should be this. Or at the very least, planted up very high in the class tree. Plenty of melee specs have ways of continuing their rotation and dealing meaningful damage from beyond the 5-yard range, while Rogue currently has no meaningful way of contributing damage (or quite frankly playing the game) if forced out of said range outside of horrificly energy inefficient globals that deal negative damage with 20 yard ranges. Currently the strongest raid builds for Outlaw have to forgo Acro, and it seriously feels really, really, really bad on some of these bosses.
Buff Killing Spree damage and uncap it while Blade Flurry is active - In the past, there was a tiny nuance to Blade Rush vs Killing Spree in AoE. KS was better within your target cap and Blade Rush was better if target count exceeded your cap (even though everyone just played Blade Rush anyways because it was much, much safer to press and wouldn’t get you killed). Now with the talents almost physically as far apart from each other as possible and you’re not choosing between them, KS should also see the uncap treatment as well as being given a bit of a damage amp so you’re not just holding it for when you have nothing else to press.
(Also as a little tidbit here, I know this is a bit on the controversial side, but I’m going to suggest either flat out removing the teleporting from Killing Spree and removing the DR you get from it, or atleast making the telporting not random, such as going in a full circle around your target and keeping the DR. Though preferably remove both entirely. Also, it should be made into a gray channel that can be canceled by pressing Killing Spree again, rather than being forced to make a macro to aura cancel it for those times when you know it’s going to get you killed.)
Keep the Fan the Hammer nerf - I know there’s a lot of people who want to see this reverted, but personally I think it was actually a step up in the thought process of playing Outlaw. Every Opportunity proc giving you max combo points was a bit unhealthy in terms of gameplay and dumbed down how the spec was played, plus it makes getting Broadsides fun and gives it value as it essentially reverts the nerf while you have it active.
Hopefully we get something soon. The radio silence on the Rogue changes from Blizzard has been quite frankly, deafening.
4 Likes
Subtlety to not rely on gimmicks is the biggest wishlist.
- no more ww hit combo danse macabre
- backstab to just do good damage instead if lingering shadow get back to dance asap nonsense.
- eviscerate to be the nail in the coffin for finishing damage again
- sanguinary vein wod choice node vs dark shadow ( sv could literally be applied through backstab if they didn’t want to bring back hemo and stealth abilities apply fw)
- shift in damage back find weakness for subtlety to be impactful so abilities can do what they are supposed to do.
- decrease dance frequently so core abilities are worth their salt.
- get gimmicks out of the class so we aren’t balanced around them.
Reduction in cc is whatever but base abilities need to be worth their weight in pvp and pve. Get secret technique outta here or turn it back into a cleaving aoe talent. Makes us look silly in pve too, we are here to destroy one target at a time. Leave aoe and cleave to the casters.
5 Likes
You don’t like permanent purple power to have unrespondable damage in 1v1 but zero usefulness against any composition with a healer, especially on the heels of the Blind nerf?
#RenoveShadowDance
4 Likes
Exactly, it’s not skillful and not fun being effective 7 seconds of every minute with a decaying backstab buff for 17 seconds till your next very dependent 7 second window.while other classes tee off with uptime.
Relying on people to do the right thing and not sit in the middle of an arena getting chunked by warlocks / mages / balance etc and actually using cc + pillaring is a bit ridiculous.
Solo shuffle feels like comp stomp due to how many people neglect to use their full kit + defensives / follow up on cc/ use pillars / drag melee out of reach of healers etc. they just run around fooling around trying to pve.
5 Likes
30% ELO He(ck)
30% RDPS favorite child syndrome
20% Your teammates flaming you
20% re-evaluating your use of $15
100% WoW Primary PvP Mode
3 Likes
This is why I’ve stopped queueing Solo Shuffle altogether.
I found a Prot Warrior in LFG the other day for 2s and we went 5-2. Those were fun.
Edit: And we got those 7 games in less time than it would’ve taken to sit in a queue for ONE Solo Shuffle.
3 Likes
What would get me back into retail rogue is dead simple.
Give me a TBC era Rogue play style and tool kit; every thing from top to bottom regarding the combo points system and base kit
Add the following abilities as default to the Class.
Shadow Step
Smoke Bomb
Dismantle
Shadow Walk
Redirect with a 10sec base CD
Recuperate
Combat readiness
Tune the damage in relation to modern health pools like Vanilla so backstabs crush cloth for around 40% of their total max buffed BiS PvP loot health pool.
3 Likes
You should give retail a try. All of those, except Shadow Walk, are available in some form via talents.
2 Likes
Go play TBC Classic then.
1 Like
what im asking for never existed
2 Likes
Yes, but the mechanics of how the class plays does not. I don’t like how most of the abilities have been changed so that its padded for terrible players to pretend they’re better than they are. This is what they have done to just about every class in WoW since Wrath and forward, and its dumb, stupid and annoying, it makes the whole play experience feel bad, and they did this because everyone wants to be the god of their class but never wants to put the work in to even get remotely close to that.
The biggest problem with retail rogue is that it does not play like an actual rogue, instead it plays like a Ret with stealth and some rogue tools. Also the class as per usual is tied down to offensive CD play and so the only kill opportunities exist inside of CD’s, tho every other class is this way too and its boring AF.
That is the sucky part about retail, and also what sucks about wrath and why since TBC was killed off that I went back to ERA, because even though the classes are super basic; they’re way more fun to play and its not just by a little, but by a whole lot.
I like just about everything about Vanilla rogue excluding its missing some key tools to play VS modern Classes, as I listed above. The only thing about Vanilla rogue that I would change other than adding some baseline skills too it are that I would use the TBC Combo Point update; the Vanilla version is tilting because it drops points if you target a different target. Also would use TBC era poison system.
4 Likes
Remember when they removed Anticipation but then gave it to Enhancement Shaman with +10 MSW stacks instead of +5, and then gave Rogues 7 combo points to balance but at the same time let Enhancement Shaman spend all 10 stacks of MSW in one spend? Classic.
The kicker? Your finishing moves will never hit as hard as Lightning Bolt.
6 Likes