Templates were bad because the old gearing system wasnt broken.
Scaling is bad all around no matter the level and has nothing to do with pvp.
Titan forging was bad and we wanted the old way tog ear up.
Blizzard failed to bring back the old system of gearing. It worked great and the player base was much larger than now in pvp
Gating behind rating was the token seller and they know it. People are paying for carries to get BIS gear when before you could do your 10 wins and get BIS gear with no rating involved. Randoms were much more competitive and enjoyable then. But you do you and enjoy your smaller player base and echo chamber.
Because during MoP almost half of all players were PvP players. Blizzard told us this even. PvE and PvP players were almost 50/50. So when 4 million Raiders quit, 4 million PvPers stayed.
Perhaps, we will see. I don’t have faith in the valor system.
I’ll elaborate.
You can’t waste honor or Conquest, because you can choose what you get weekly at the vendor.
PvE, you can’t, you rely on 3 choices at max a week, and hopefully you get an upgrade, but lets say you get an upgrade that is better than the item you’ve been upgrading, you’ve wasted your valor.
It is inefficient in contrast to Conquest or honor.
If they simply put a vendor out for PvE and called it a day, they probably would be better off than trying to implement two systems that don’t work in harmony together.
Some players like WoD because it was easy to level alts. Or because it only took a weekend to gear.
Alt friendly is a nice way of saying not much content. Gearing in a weekend through pvp, means it useless outside of instanced pvp. Lobby pvp kind of worked in MoP. It did not work in WoD. It doesn’t work in Legion, BFA, or SL with the content they have tried to add to solve MoP/ WoD’s issues.
You are admitting you were carried by high rated friends. Still a carry.
What is this “Lobby PvP” that “didn’t work in wod”? People got PvP gear to use in PvP. People who played like that didn’t run out of content at all, because the PvP never ended.
If they wanted PvE gear to use in PvE, there were other, better ways to get it.
Pvp players liked WoD because the pvp was great. You call pvp “lobby content” but let me ask you what is Mythic+? What are raids? Instanced “lobbied” content where literally your opponent does the exact same thing every single time you run it. Yawn.
People quit WoD because of flying and no raid content. PvP players stayed. Not sure why you think pvp gear of all things was WoDs issue.
Alt friendly means no time gated grinds and hoops to jump through to be competitive. Systems and time gates are not content. Without time gates, my alt rogue finished his Maw, and covenant campaign completely in 18 hrs. For the price of WoW, that is not much content.
Interesting point. WoD started with 11 million players. It lost nearly 10 million. Sounds like pvp really is a side game and shouldn’t get much development.
Yeah, those darn hoops. Questing/ leveling. Professions. Guilds. Dungeons, Raids. No place in mmorpg pvp. LuL.
Lobby pvp is pretty straight forward. Login–> que games. Works in LoL. Works in counterstrike. In an mmorpg, like WoW in order to achieve that you have to pretty much disable everything that makes the game an mmorpg. Questing/ Leveling, professions, pve, racials, factions, guilds, etc. Dead game.
this is standard behaviour wayy late in any season of any pvp environment. it happens in esports as well, this is as much a player issue as it is a blizzard issue, blizzard should have released 9.1 way way way WAY earlier so that pvpers could have a season reset.
Last official Blizzard numbers on subs was WoD launched with just over 8 million subs and the last reported subs from Blizzard was 5.5 mil in 2015.
WoD did lose a lot of subs yes but it did not lose 10 million. Lol.
The hoops I’m referring to are: Covenant Renoun, Anima, Soul Ash, Conduits, needing 16000 conquest points and getting 25 points a win…
Sounds like you have something against pvp players which is hilarious to me. PvP players pay the same sub you do and have been playing WSG since 2005 and Nagrand Arena since 2007. At any rate you never answered my question: What does pvp gear have to do with WoDs sub loss? And as far as “mini game” Raiders are the least population of WoW players. Raiding is the “mini game” now. Perhaps raids should stop getting development resources since relatively so few people do it.
I’ve been playing since tbc. I’ve never been glad but when I can focus I’ve been over 2k a few times. I don’t consider myself an amazing pvp player. I came on here to echo every sentiment of this post. I don’t understand how blizzard is not doing something about this. I am one week into an alt and I have zero epic pvp pieces.
You get no points for losses. There are not enough people playing that are not carries. I’ve even had a couple of bored people offer to just help grind some. It’s not fun to gear up alts right now. They need to give more points overall for wins or do something about the fact that it’s extremely painful to grind conquest when you DO NOT QUALIFY TO PLAY WITH OTHER PEOPLE OR YOU ARE ENCOURAGED TO PAY SOMEONE TO CARRY.
I don’t need a gd carry. You are making pay to play for a lot of people in rated pvp right now.
I need some gear to play and have fun. I don’t need it to take a month.
I also don’t need people with 45k health in sub 1k brackets where my alts start out at.
BLIZZARD THIS IS FOR YOU. Quit spending all your resources into a game that we’ve already played and fix the problems you just created.
When did I admit this? If you knew how to read correctly, you would see that I was referring to Arena, not the 1800 rating I achieved in RBG’s. Nice try though! I did every run with a random group, or a few runs with some people I friended while doing them. You are just mad that you suck. It’s kind of sad to be honest. “Someone did the grind and is proving it isn’t that hard, THEY ARE GETTING CARRIED”. Whatever helps you sleep at night. Get good son!
I did it quite easy. People just don’t want to admit they are playing in the rating they deserve to play in. Get better and improve instead of blaming the system.
M+ drops 210 iLVL at best, and is RNG. The cache gives you one chance per week at a random piece of 226 gear that may not be an upgrade. PVP still offers better since you can farm conquest and upgrade all your gear when you hit a certain rating.
Sure 55% cannot get past 1400, or is it that a good percentage of the playing base has stopped at 1400 because this is where the mount used to be before the change to 1000 rating? I got to 1400 in arena on my druid and gave up at one point with arena because all I wanted was to get my mount.
Yes some people want to get high rating, but also some people are just simply not good enough. Like the dude who complained TC was too hard, sitting at 157 iLVL. Or the guy who complained PVP is too hard, at sub 200 iLVL with like 10 PVP games to their name.
I have hundreds of games played and know one thing, I am not good enough, period, and I sit at 224 iLVL. Best I got this season was 1800 in RBG and could not actually get past about 1500 in arena, and I have been doing PVP since Classic and done M15+ and mythic raiding so I know my class and how to play, but that doesn’t mean I can all of a sudden get higher rating in PVP, I am still just not good enough.
I even tried doing arena 3’s in the last few weeks with 2 other players who are great at PVE content and both geared, but we got just past 1400 each and that was it, it was win > lose > win > lose all the way after that. The grind is not broken, it’s just not easy like some of you think it should be.
I did PvP for fun. I didn’t do PvP for gear. Whats not fun is going up against a constant uphill gap that’s not created because of skill. You think to yourself “How can it get harder than this?” but as you get higher it quite literally does. There are more gladiators playing in 1400-1800 than there are 2400+. This PvP system fosters boosters and gold selling creating a self perputating cycle that purposely keeps the rich richer by a large margin.