Not harder for me. For the guild I’m in.
Absolutely! This is a decent argument you post for my point about having diverse options, that can scale in difficulty, to accommodate more than one player.
By the time people start running in out of gear season 2 will be released.
I’ll finally get that BIS cache piece on the day the next expac prepatch opens lol
I dont think there is a problem, the way gearing is going to work in SL seems fine to me
Mythic raiding or bust yay!
M+ you have a 3% chance at good mythic quality loot per week.
Mythic raiding you have a 25% chance per boss, + a cache + any loot your raid members don’t need.
Doesn’t matter if you’re doing +25 dungeons that are harder than all but the very last mythic boss, you still get 210 instead of 233!!!
The step change in difficulty from heroic to mythic is by far the largest single difficulty step change in the game.
It also comes with many more restrictions such as a fixed raid size, raid ID lockout, and lack of cross realm.
Also bench and alternate swapping per boss impacts the available gear each person can get.
So it’s not quite as simple.
And 226 gear pacing favors mythic+ early in the patch and raiding late in the patch.
Your numbers make no sense thought, you are not looking for just 1 specific gear drop from the vault, even items with subpar stats are going to be an upgrade the first couple of months, for any of your 16 slots.
the way gearing is going to work in SL seems fine to me
It doesn’t to me. 15s should drop 213s. 15s are harder than Heroic raids, so that’s fair if it drops equivalent loot, but with no lockouts.
speak for yourself-- yikes.
I hope devs don’t think like this.
Not really. If I have a 213 haste mastery piece and I get a 226 Crit vers piece from the cache, I’m probably going to keep the 213 piece if those are my best stats. Secondary stats vastly outweigh primary stats for most specs.
I started playing the game again on August 8th and it took me about 3-4 weeks to grind out M+ to a 1500 io score and start doing 15s. This was a literal like 400-470 iLvl in a couple of weeks which seemed wayyyyy too fast.
This will happen next expansion, especially in seasons 2+. People will be blowing out in +15 iLvl gear in 2 weeks while guilds are just learning to clear the new raid tiers.
If you compare a player that only does 1 vs the other one, who is going to have more ilv?
At the start the guy raiding heroic might get 2-3 items from the raid, while the one doing m+ can do it until he is in a full set.
Long term the guy raiding heroic is stuck at that ilv and the one doing m+ is almost full mythic ilv.
Not really. If I have a 213 haste mastery piece and I get a 226 Crit vers piece from the cache, I’m probably going to keep the 213 piece if those are my best stats. Secondary stats vastly outweigh primary stats for most specs.
This will for sure be an issue.
And mythic+ has WAY more secondary stat combos than the raid.
Also, the raid only has 3 rings, so 3 of the 6 secondary stat combos.
Mythic+ has 10 rings with all 6 combos covered and 4 combos having duplicates so if they are your best stat you can wear them x2.
For most specs 210 gear with the correct/better stats > 213 gear with worse stats.
Back to a mix of both for BiS.
So… Would love to know what a solution is. What exactly are people seeking that would make M+ more valuable for M+ runners?
And you have to keep in mind that Blizzard’s design is to gate reward structures, so you can’t no-life your way to BiS gear in a short amount of time.
Upping the end of dungeon rewards would be acceptable in comparison to raiding if they added lockouts, but I feel that would undermine the system itself.
Perhaps a currency with a weekly cap? I’d love to see the return of valor points or something similar. Something that would drop from both M+ and Raiding, that you could possibly farm and save up for a specific piece weeks at a time. I enjoyed those systems up through MoP and I honestly don’t know why they removed them.
I’d love to see some farmable bad luck protection return to the game. It kept me engaged longer.
But aside from that, what else can they do to make key-pushers happy, aside from completely breaking the game with endless high level gear?
If you compare a player that only does 1 vs the other one, who is going to have more ilv?
Mythic raiders will have higher ilvl. And the gear will be overall better too.
At the start the guy raiding heroic might get 2-3 items from the raid, while the one doing m+ can do it until he is in a full set.
The guy raiding Heroic for 2-3 items will invest many less hours than the guy who is doing M+ for a full set.
And the guy who’ll have the most gear will be the one who did both.
If I have a 213 haste mastery piece and I get a 226 Crit vers piece from the cache, I’m probably going to keep the 213 piece if those are my best stats.
This is less true in early patches. Secondaries only start massively outpacing ilvl in later patches.
Most specs also don’t have that big a discrepency on their secondaries. For Unholy DK for instance all secondaries are pretty close to each other, even if Crit/Haste are higher weight than Mastery/Versatility.
I started playing the game again on August 8th and it took me about 3-4 weeks to grind out M+ to a 1500 io score and start doing 15s. This was a literal like 400-470 iLvl in a couple of weeks which seemed wayyyyy too fast.
Hang on a minute… You were able to do this 8 months after the season came out, while probably in groups who vastly outgeared the dungeons???
HOW CAN THIS BE ALLOWED???
And mythic+ has WAY more secondary stat combos than the raid.
I’m interested to see if it will stay this way, that would be quite weird for Blizzard to do… It may just be like this for the first tier…
So… Would love to know what a solution is. What exactly are people seeking that would make M+ more valuable for M+ runners
Mythic gear from +20s if timed.
Easy
This is less true in early patches. Secondaries only start massively outpacing ilvl in later patches.
I would strongly argue in the other direction. If you are a haste based spec in the first tier you need to eek out every single bit of haste you can because the values are so low
Mythic gear from +20s if timed.
Easy
From every 20 that was timed? A piece of gear each time? Sounds very unlikely. But good luck pushing it.
It’s quite obvious that their design philosophy won’t allow an avenue for an uncapped farming of the best gear available. Otherwise they would’ve never imposed mythic raid lockouts.
How many people do you know in seasons that are not inflated by corruption who are regularly timing +20s?
And those who do deserve mythic loot. If there needs to be a weekly lock that you can only get 1 piece per dungeon or something for that week that would be fine too
How can you prove that? Nearly everyone I know that all raided hated M+ and only did it for the gear. The PvPers I know did it for the gear so they could arena, they had to raid too. I myself enjoy M+ but it’s behind PvP and Raiding for me.
The loot in BFA was so insane that everyone playing the game outside of people that only did world quests where forced into M+.