All you do is solidify my point. You can’t tackle it maturely. You don’t have the tools for it. I was a raid leader for a very long time, I wasn’t hurt by anyone or anything. I simply didn’t like watching people get left out and fall behind because of the cliques in the guild. This is why I’ve maintained friendships over 16 years of playing Warcraft. Can you say the same? Probably not.
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Didn’t realize Legion had corruption, which is when this Mythic+ powercreep burnt me out.
Yes and the genre is a niche one nowadays. Opening up gearing avenues gives people a reason to expand the forms of content they might want to participate in. Narrowing it will inevitably lower participation as our monkey brains perceive the changes as negative instead of the positive raiders think it is. People will quit over this. Not everyone but enough that it hurts more than it helps the overall health of the game. Just look how dead the PvP community is thanks to all the gearing changes over the years.
After Legion which had problems but was still viewed as a net positive they keep making bad decisions with systems and now even loot structure. It pushes people away from WoW and a lot never return.
Which is fine. Wow had it’s time in the sun…and even a little more. Back when it was the most popular it was raid or die. You could get a few pieces of loot with badges but ultimately it was a fairly slow process in gearing up and felt rewarding. I’m glad it’s going back to that somewhat.
They will. People will quit over anything. Wow was pushing way too close to an ARPG loot pinata where gear was basically meaningless.
It’s still meaningless in SL other than the ilvl attached to it. Sorry to break your bubble but unless they start making gear like Classic or TBC again it won’t mean anything.
Trinkets are the only pieces of gear that hold any real value with their special effects and our legendary items but they keep getting nerfed into oblivion because of how overtuned they are. Bring back multiple sockets, gems that add bonus effects instead of just flat stats, make crafting more than just Legendary materials and stat sticks.
Transmogs is great but took away more from the feeling of gear being special than anything. They won’t get rid of transmog so a better option would be making gear highly customizable. Instead we’re getting more of the same lazy design but just less of it. Gear won’t be anymore meaningful than BFA, we’re just going to be vendoring less of it.
I still think it’s a small step in the right direction.
I REALLY wish crafting had more weight to it…
I do agree with you on that. I love transmog and accept the hit it gives to making gear a little less special.
That would be GREAT. I do think they have some REALLY good looking sets for covenants, the first raid and the maw.
Why should raids give the best gear?
Not everybody has a great super fantastical extra skilled guild to be a part of for mythic raids.
not everybody has 3+ hours, 2-3 or even sometimes 4 times a week to comit to raiding, on top of the gear grinding and getting enchants/gems.
Some people only have time for maybe a Mythic+ dungeon every other day or so. Some people do not want to mindlessly devote themselves to a video game like that.
So no, raids should not offer the only way to get the best gear, because some people do not want to do nothing but raid.
Some people like doing pvp, so therefore they had/have pvp gear.
Some people like doing Dungeons, so they have dungeon gear
Some people like just casually playing the game, so they have things like heroics and LFR and unranked pvp.
First, those players already had something to strive for, it just did not allign with YOUR motivation. Some people just flat out have no interest in raiding. At all, in the slightest, not even once.
Why should they be held back? Just because YOU think raiding is the best way to play the game?
Its the same mentality as the dipsticks who said flight was a problem. It never was, and would be, a problem. It did not ruin immersion, it did not give people an unfair advantage. It was just another means of transportation, and one that World of Warcraft had over literally every other MMORPG out there…until everybody copied Blizzard, but at the same time Blizzard went and ruined it by putting it behind a meaningless grind that pretty much nobody enjoyed, let alone asked for.
But again, just because YOU think raids are the bees knees, does not mean other people should receive lesser rewards…just as people who do not like flying, should not have tried forcing their whacky ideals on other people.
With the exception of geninely ruining another players’ game experience, you should be able to play however you damn well choose, and not be hindered for it.
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Because raids take a lot more investment into the game rather than just logging on and pugging some M+ for an hour or two.
Should people who only play the game for a couple hours a week be on equal terms with people who invest more time?
It’s 1 base item and 1 extra item for timing.
So 1 less than BFA not 1 total.
It’s like this on the beta.
No its not, as the Dungeom loot is locked to mythic 7 until Mythic raids come out.
IE they cant do this anyway.
Well you certainly aren’t being left behind if you don’t want to raid considering you’re getting a Mythic ilvl piece each week if you clear a +15.
Also raids have been Blizzards cornerstone when making new content. When new content comes out each patch we’re not seeing a cinematic for you doing Ataldazar for the 37th time, there’s a cinematic for Nyalotha. So far as I remember, Karazhan was the only exception to that rule in recent expansions.
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Then this is the wrong genre of game for you. MMOs are (should be) a slow burn. You need to put in the time to get the gear. They’ve always been like that until you got spoiled with the literal raining of gear for the last 2 expansions.
They still do. M+ still exists and it still rewards gear.
Because that’s the design of MMOs.
Now that’s something we agree on. Flying should have never been locked behind the single longest time gate in wow history.
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Umm the loot was changed.
Its 1 drop per dungeon no matter the chest.
Its what 30 mins for each Dungeon, you would need to do 5 to get each person a piece.
If you clear all the raid pretty much everyone will get at least 1 piece. If it takes you more than 2.5 hours to clear Herioc, you need to reevaluate your life choices.
People trying to full gear through M+ Will have a LOT more time invested than a Herioc Raider.
Also the i thought the community switched to a Skill level metric for loot progession?
If not, let’s add back Valor gear and give Valor in M+ for top end gear. As this system doesn’t award Time Spent either.
I love how the community flip flops metrics to make their current stupidity valid.
I’m replying to their point about only having a certain amount of time per week and still wanting to be on par with other players.
Also were talking about now and before, how the systems have been and how going into shadowlands the changes are for the better.
So your whole reply is out of context and makes no sense.
Its 1 item base and 1 for timing.
It’s been like this on the beta for weeks.
Someone only clearing heroic will NEVER see a 226 piece of gear.
Something doing mythic+ will get a guaranteed 226 item (a few choices of them depending on how many they ran) every single week.
And mythic+ covers all the stat combinations on every slot, while the raid does not. So a 210 with your two BiS secondaries will by far trump a 213 without them.
I am not going to keep going back and forth about the chest with you, we have both highlighted our points there, going to have to agree to disagree on that.
Not true AT all sadly, this was actually used as a defense for the crap PVP gear in those threads. The stat distribution is very bad in SL. Most the gear from M+ matches that found in raids, and there is very few options as a whole. From the early datamining. Some slots get love, and get a bunch of pieces with alot being pretty much repeats, but alot get litte.
There is no agreeing or disagree with the weekly chest.
It works how it works and that’s it.
Wowhead and icy-veins both have updated articles about it.
It does work how it works,
my disagreement is trying to count that as a “Well thats ho Mythic Plus players can get btter loot than raiders”
Enter, kill mythic boss get mythic chest.
After that change, the argument of the mythic piece from mythic + chest is dead, there has not been a single patch that I couldn’t get a pug group to kill the first 3, on my top 5 server. That may affect smaller servers, sure, but then they need to move to a top 5 server.
Raiders with coins, also have a much better shot at targeting loot. As well as (And this is what I do today lol) targeting bosses they need, and ignoring others.
I dont run 12/12 to get a dres trinket, I pug a dres group, kill dres, get trinket or roll coins till I get trinket.
The reason raiding has always been king (and, in my opinion, should remain the king) is that WoW is a Massive Multi-Player Online RPG. The content that requires large group coordination and cooperation should remain the defining pinnacle of the gameplay.
That’s just my view on it, and it is the reason I believe raiding trumps everything else. Sure, you can push M+ to a difficulty beyond raiding, but you cannot deny that getting 20 dedicated people to show up every week through hundreds of pulls requires more effort. It is the reason the game exists…to promote this kind of cooperative play. That’s why it’s the defining content.
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If they have more skill, sure. Let the rewards be for skills, not just time spent. You are saying that an arena player should have to do 50 games before rating. Yes, this is what you are saying. You are telling people that time spent should equal rewards, so when I spend 7 days in Epic BGs all day and night, what exactly is my reward? I’ve spent more time in Epic BGs than you have in raids. Do I have a similar reward as you? Nope. I have nothing but very crappy 445 gear, and what do you get in raiding? The ability to 2 shot me without a 2nd thought. So your point is again, invalid.
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