The Infamous Horde Bias

My view as a Horde player is that where there is dev bias and Horde favoritism, it is in very specific places and situations, and often, these are things that do not benefit the Horde as a faction, but benefit the devs and the people who put those things in order.

I view Horde and Alliance players to have been abused by these selfish devs, who didn’t actually care about the well being of either faction, and just wanted what they wanted.

I see that Blood Elves get updates and focus in scenes with orcs, but Forsaken, Tauren, and Goblins tend to take a back seat to the additions and changes, even if these changes and progressions in story somehow involved them.

I see the Horde used as a poorly written punching bag that has some members benefitting from the strife, whereas others are shelved, or pinholed into really uncomfortable cookie cutter designs that do not fit or represent the player population.

I see the Alliance cast as heroes and the ‘good’ guys, but their roles and designs are so boring and unoriginal that they’re cardboard cutouts, and they also don’t represent the player base. Humans and elves, orcs and elves everywhere, but just as you say, when the Dwarves come up? Nothing. How are the Gnomes?

I think that the problem with pointing this out as Horde bias and how the Horde “gets” special treatment ignores an even larger problem, which is that the Horde isn’t actually regarded with much decency or care by those that chose to exploit it. And my hope is that with the changes being made, there will be acts to balance this, and that both factions, of all races, are treated with care, whether it’s through good story telling, customization options, gameplay, racials, and more.

Alas, if there needs to be proof of bias, and a demonstration made of how Horde is also suffering, I’d like to note that there are more male orc customizations available than any other race type, and for most of them, even if you combine both male and female options, they do not come close to how many orc male customizations are available.

Yet, as a female Forsaken player? Well, at least I can finally hide my bones to show that my character wouldn’t go and punch holes in perfectly good armor.

A lot needs to be done to balance this. I think that it’s less of a bias issue, and more of a, “we need people to be less selfish in how they’re building this game.”

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What?!? He’s not gonna buy an American-made Automobile to help stimulate the economy?

I don’t really know how anybody could look at the 3 exalted rep mounts for Alliance in BfA (3 horses) vs Horde’s (3 discrete, unique mounts), or how Uldir was initially planned as a Horde-only raid (Alliance were to get … oh yeah, nothing), AND the OVERWHELMING popularity of Horde for PvE and PvP, such that they’re literally having to allow Alliance players to group with Hordies to allow half the playerbase to actually play the game competitively, and STILL believe Blizzard has been an impartial referee of Alliance-Horde player experience.

I’m sympathetic to the recurring theme of turning Horde leaders into punching bags, but the material condition of Alliance players is worse than that of Horde’s, and at any point of direct comparison, it’s clear why that is.

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Bee mount is one of the best mounts in the game and alliance lore is horses.

Except they didn’t, and that raid was bad. Kinda like how Emerald nightmare wasn’t so good but had an entire alliance focus.

not remotely a blizzard problem imo

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Bee mount was made specifically because Alliance players were so aggrieved by how awfully they’d been treated. If that’s not the developer tacitly admitting they take sides, I don’t know what is.

The fact Uldir was pitched as Horde-only at all is wild. I don’t mean that as ‘Horde-focused’, I mean that as ‘literally Horde only’.

And who do you think develops the game? Horde-Alliance ratios are not organic, and when they were bad in Vanilla (Alliance-favored), they introduced Blood Elves to compensate. Horde didn’t become the #1 faction overnight. It’s a consequence of Blizzard’s actions.

I’m really not interested in discussing this with somebody as dishonest as you’re being. The OP has extensive receipts about this - I was only musing about how either dense or self-delusional one has to be to believe anything different. The only thing you should be doing is wondering which one of those two you are.

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No it wasn’t. Bee mount just happened to be released around the time everyone was having a big cry about how they didn’t like the horse mounts…which I actually think are some of the best mounts in the game. Horde doesn’t have any cool looking high rez basic horse options in different colors with hair that has physics like the Alliance got.

How would that even work? Alliance just doesn’t get to raid? I’m gonna press X to doubt this one.

Ion Cannon

It’s more a consequence of the community’s action. Here’s a bit of internet history for you.

The great horde exodus happened in Legion during Tomb of Sargeras. The #2 guild in America at the time was “Easy” led by an alcoholic named Tmsean. They were progressing on Mythic Kil’Jaeden, and they were continuously wiping to a mechanic that knocked your character off the platform, specifically during the intermission when you couldn’t see anything and you had to be finding Illidan or whatever and killing adds.

They discovered that the EU guys who were horde at the time had all mysteriously race changed to Goblin. It wasn’t OP racials in the sense that they did increased damage, they were OP because this particular racial could displace the knockback. Had alliance had void elves at the time with their mini-alter, there would have been no reason to transfer.

Now, once Easy had made the swap, a few of the other super cutting edge guilds started to follow. Horde was starting to have an overwhelming majority when it came to the very top guilds. Because of this, the top players were going horde to apply to these top guilds.

This particular racial didn’t even end up being required for the boss. Someone discovered a strat where a BDK could mass grip all of KJ’s adds right as the phase changed by positioning KJ in the corner, and if you did it correctly you could complete the phase before the knockback even went off, and the need for goblin jump was no longer there. So, unless you were Easy or one of the other very top top guilds making the switch, it wasn’t for racial bonuses.

Now, another very interesting thing happened in Legion.

M+ released, and people from different guilds started playing together more often. If you ran keys with anyone in these top guilds mentioned previously, and they went horde…well you went horde too. Not only were these raiders transferring, but their entire ecosystems were following. The casuals who bought runs from them, their key group partners, their PvP teams, etc.

Eventually, it got to the point where if you were a serious key pusher, you just wanted to be horde. Everyone good to play with was on horde, all the top guilds were on horde, and by consolidating the competitive players into 1 faction, the community had made everyone’s lives better (as long as you went horde).

This isn’t a Blizzard problem, it’s a community problem, and Blizzard has to just embrace the fact that the community is going to game the system to be able to have the biggest possible pool of players to engage in content with. Cross faction play was always the answer.

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The Horde is also always destroyed by the Horde.

The two times the faction conflict became central to the story, the Horde broke apart in civil war. Most of the achievements the Horde experiences in the Cata/MOP war and the BFA war are under the influence of the same leadership we wind up revolting against. This makes the remaining Horde feel like it experiences no real victories but all the defeats (Dazar’alor is an Alliance victory with no permanent damage to anything that matters in the Alliance, both Warfronts are canonically won by the Alliance, Alliance successfully pushes Forsaken out of Lordaeron, etc.) Meanwhile, the Horde accomplishes victories in moments like Teldrassil or Theramore thanks to our leadership using genocidal WMD tactics while we watch.

Additionally, Horde races are more likely to be used as villainous fodder, and not central expansion protagonists.

I’ll admit there is, however, an ELF bias.

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The Alliance is the power faction lore-wise and this was evident across most expansions. Who defeated Lei-Shen and got all his power stored into a staff which is used in the Siege of Orgrimmar?

The faction war is so obnoxious at this point because no one is allowed to win. Well, this is not quite true. The Horde won when it came to reducing the Night Elves into a minority group…

Because they are written like this. They simply don’t know what to do, similar how Baine is treated across Shadowlands. The Alliance has at least three other fantasy races they could use of but they do not. At least the Gnomes got a short spotlight for once.

I am not sure if I heard this before. Was this on the making of DVD which came with the Collector’s Edition for WoD? Would like to know more about this. Some of the most interesting development stuff is scattered across the internet in several interviews, short videos and so on - which makes it very hard to find.

The bee-mount was never planned to become an usable mount until Ion Hazzikostas was criticized (see the link several posts above) during the reddit BfA ama where he started teasing the mount due the negative backlash.

I sound like a broken record at this point but we should not have access to a Kul Tiran zone mount as the Alliance should also not have access to our Pterrordax-mount (but they have). As long as the Horde has no access to a very own beekeeper location, this mount should stay Alliance-exclusive. It’s basically a Kul Tiran mount.

We do have access to a few of the updated basic horses.
Do you really want to have a full color palette of horses for the Horde? Are you really sure about this? The horses are associated with low quality management control when it comes to WoW.

And as a bonus, for the Horde-only people who don’t realize you’ll get a horse mount by playing both sides:

hahahaahaha

its not an one time event. for example, they gave blood elves to the horde, even though alliance players were already asking for playable high elves in vanilla, who were peppered around the game, such as hinterlands, eastern plaguelands and a high elf mage trainer in the stormwind mage tower. these were high elves who didnt follow kael’thas to outlands, stayed loyal to the alliance and thus didnt rename themselves blood elves. they would also be represented later as the silver covenant under the leadership of sylvannas’ sister, veressa.

to add salt in the wound, the devs gave them paladins who had an unique pally ability, not given to alliance pallies. they instantly switched the faction imbalance from 60 ALLIANCE / 40 HORDE to 60 HORDE / 40 ALLIANCE. and it stayed that way with some minor fluctations till mists of pandaria, when trolls were the top banana and alliance started switching to horde. it had a brief switch back on the pvp side when humans were given back their emfh racial, which lasted a whole month.

in the backdrop of this was the devs publically insulting the entire alliance faction and a myriad of other little injuries to faction pride/cohesiveness.

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Typical “look at me I’m Alliance and I want to cry about something” post.

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you look pretty snazzy in that gear. the complaints are not your fault. i dont blame you for wanting to play a thalassian. their gear fits them well and they always look classy.

Lucky for you, you’re playing a hybrid smurf elf w/ the same skeleton as a belf.

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not my fault either. i advocated for half elves instead, particularly since elisonde even called the quel’dorei, half elves essentially, from the high elves mating with humans, during her speech about the elves disappointing her. we even had an artwork of half human/half elf 3d models, which the artist said was a mix of belfs, nelfs and humans. different bodies. different stances. etc. but ion thought there werent enough of them to be an allied race.


blood elves are playable high elves. faction restrictions coming down, just make a blood elf.

make a what? (lilock’s belf hunter hehe)

:sparkling_heart:

im so proud

like my pet? huh? do yah? aint he groovy? i swiped him from throne of thunder.

Then go horde and reap the benefits, you babies.

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