I love threads like this, because screaming into the void will change nothing.
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In fact, Classic’s story is so good I’m considering making a Horde character again. I haven’t played Horde in ages, thanks to their awful writing. But here in Classic, the Horde is actually just that: The Horde. Love it. Thank you Blizzard for Classic. <3
Oh, so this thread is basically crying about High Elves being on the Horde, and ranting about Classic.
Fortunately, as far as that story goes, we know how it ends. Enjoy your static story.
At least in game, you will be whining in Classic and not in Retail.
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That’s a negative. Not sure how you got that idea. In fact, that’s not even canon, so…?
This thread is saying how much better WoW’s story and gameplay feels now that Blood Elves are no longer apart of the Horde. I feel like I’m actually playing Warcraft again. It’s amazing! 
There’s a whole universe of options that could happen. Who knows, maybe this time Kael’thas won’t be vilified and killed off for no reason whatsoever.
Nothing to whine about. Things are great. Haven’t felt this good to play Warcraft games since… Wow. So, so, so, so long ago… I’m getting old. D:
I also really enjoy the Classic Story more so than retail, but I do not think that is because of the lack of any race in the Horde. Instead it is all about the themes of survival, honor, and unity themes that in Classic were very much about ‘trending toward unity’ instead of another expansion of the Horde tearing itself apart.
I always got the impression that in Vanilla, our characters were not saving the world with each zone they moved through, but that as they grew stronger, they were generally leaving the Horde towns a bit better, and a bit more unified. Slowly proving yourself to the other members of the Horde, and forming ever stronger bonds with your fellow Horde members of all races.
I don’t think that story would be any less effective then if there were Blood Elves, or Goblins, or any other Horde race fighting alongside us. The Horde has always been strengthened by those races that choose to join it. It would be nice if the story remembered that the Horde was about very different races banding together, instead of splintering apart.
Blood Elves on the Horde didn’t ruin the story…
Blizzard’s hyper focus on their comic book characters and disregardin’ the PC is what ruined the story.
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Narrows eyes
What? That’s why Lor’themar never wanted power and consistently denies being crowned, right? Because power.
You either don’t know/remember Lor’themar’s characterization or you just don’t care.
I don’t think that the Naaru are deities to the Draenei, but point taken. I don’t agree with it though, that wouldn’t be an alliance action at all. That would just be a priestly or Night Elven action, but not an alliance one. The alliance don’t have anything to do with Elune aside from her chosen people circumstantially allied with them.
Besides, Velen is more willing than most to act on his own as a mediator and healer, really one of the traits I admire about his characterization.
That doesn’t mean anything.
This doesn’t add anything to the conversation other than “hurpaderp I dont like that people like elves”. It’s like,… ok? So what.
Narrowing eyes more
yup.
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Define too much liberalism.
Aren’t you talking about the Alliance of Lordaeron? The one that the High Elves turned their back on?
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The Horde in classic is just as liberal in regards to races in classic as it is in retail. You don’t play Horde. No one believes you, broseph.
You are not the person to ask this.
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Lol… Focusing on the PC is the biggest mistakes Blizzard ever made. What are you talking about? Imagine killing off Tirion Fordring just so Paladins could wield Ashbringer. Like come on. Way to completely destroy any meaning the sword and character had.
Lor’themar is the sole leader of the Blood Elven people, no? It’s called putting on a show. If telling people I didn’t want to be their leader caused them to admire me more and want me as their leader more, ofc I’d say I don’t want to be their leader. That’s like manipulation 101. Hence why he banished Alleria. The only living Quel’dorei who could usurp his rule, as she is the greatest hero in Quel’dorei history. She gave 1,000 years of her life protecting her homeworld from the Burning Legion, and protecting the people of Quel’thelas from extinction, and Lor’themar brandished her as an outcast and a traitor the first moment he had any excuse. If you can’t see that Lor’themar’s a tyrannical dictator, Idk what to tell you bro.
Not sure what to tell you. I felt like Cataclysm was a Horde expansion, just due to the fact that the previous Warchief was the main protagonist. Just like how I considered Legion an Alliance expansion. Sure, Illidan and Thrall were both in neutral roles, but they are so clearly linked to their OG factions, that it’s pretty much impossible to consider them not members of said factions. You really think Illidan would’ve just stood by in a neutral role while Sylvanas burned down Teldrassil?
It’s a lot hard to explain if you don’t already know the basis of the definition. Uhm, think like too much freedom, no rules or regulations to the story. Anything that is convenient for the plot at the time can happen, even at the expense of previously established rules.
For example, Calia Menethil. Regardless of whatever explanation Blizzard came up with on the spot for Calia being raised as a Lightforged Undead, that doesn’t mean that it’s good writing and okay. In ALL of WoW history prior to Calia Menethil, it has been clearly established that the Light has the power to resurrect people, as well is very anti-Undeath. But Blizzard insisted on giving the Alliance a Lightforged Undead character, so they wrote a whole new version of how to raise Undead, using the Light, and thus made Calia Menethil.
This is overall essentially rewriting the rules of how the Light works, to fit their current narrative, and pretty much damaged the previous lore altogether.
Another example, though this one is a bit different, would be the lowered restrictions of race/class combos. For the longest time Druids have been a very conservative class, with very few racial options. For the longest time it was only Night Elves and Tauren. And this is what made Druids really cool. However, now, by the time of BFA, we’re sitting here with two flavors of Humans who can be Druids. Prior to Cataclysm, it was completely unheard of for Humans to be Druids. In fact, in the Stormrage, Malfurion even states that there are absolutely zero Human Druids, when referring to Lucan Foxblood.
While there are definitely different cultures among Humans, none of them ever showed the ability to transform into animals, summon Treants, etc. Yet, as Blizzard has progressed the story, they just wrote it in that, hey Kul Tirans have had Druids this entire time, and were just conveniently never brought up. They even come with their own unique animal forms and everything!
I really don’t have a problem with blood elves in the horde. I think it even works in a meta sort of way, where the one uptight and proper race in a group full of misfits can be, in its own way, the misfit of the group. And I don’t think their inclusion in the horde is what narratively harmed it.
That so many people play blood elves just means people tend to be a little shallow with their race choices.
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And how is that?
Your king asked us to repay the favor by going on a suicide mission?
we were always 2nd class citizens for you.
I don’t play RPGs to watch other people’s characters… I play for MY character. I couldn’t care less what ever Sylvanas, or Jaina, or Thrall, or Anduin are doin’… I care ‘bout what I’M doin’.
This is where MMOs like SWTOR and FFXIV blow WOW away in terms of story tellin’. WOW has forgotten what it means to be an RPG. These days, it’s just a dungeon crawler that lets you walk 'round the lobby while you wait.
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If you feel like you’re Ashbringer feels less of an icon in the lore because another paladin is carrying Ashbringer too, it’s your ego that needs help, not the game’s story. Legion was great.
Blizzard might have been much happier staying with RTS games to tell their story instead of an RPG. That way they wouldn’t have sudden jealousy pangs when they try to put the player character into important “Champion” roles that might overshadow their characters.
I honestly wouldn’t doubt that Metzen hated Legion above all other expansions. Seeing someone else running around the Doomhammer instead of his boi quite possibly caused a few rage issues.
Of course, that’s just a speculation.
PS: I’m curious if you think that if Blood Elves don’t belong in the Horde because it disrupts their “unique nature” then if you think the same about the undead. In WC3 they were basically the orcs rediscovering their shamanistic roots after demonic corruption along with trolls and tauren all just trying to survive to see the next day. From the start the undead were on a raging vengeance mission and and anything they could take their anger out on was fair game. Not exactly fitting in with that “just trying to get by” motif.
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Yes and no.
There’s the three factions with in the higher thallasian society.
The Magisters, the Blood Knights, and the Farstriders, and they could easily make a counsel in the absence of Lor’themar. There are those much much more power hungry than Lor’themar freaking Theron, just go do the Blood Elf starting area, no shortage of power hunger and elitism there.
Dude,… they straight up show you exactly why he banished Alleria. You don’t even have to do the content yourself, just watch a video or something. It’s the Nightborne unlock scenario, the part where Lor’themar shows the Nightborne the sunwell.
Indeed, which is why he was quaint with her earlier in said scenario. He wanted to give her a chance, which was something he didn’t have to do.
This is news to me that anyone would think that Lor’themar is a dictator, much less the Alliance who accept theocracies into their fold, but apparently look down upon Lor’themar’s government.
I wouldn’t say Cataclysm is a Horde expansion, but it’s fair to consider it as such because of a certain focus on traditionally Horde themes. Such as the elements, black dragons, the twlight’s hammer, and of course Thrall.
Thrall was, but not Illidan, because Illidan was never Alliance you silly crazy person. Just because he’s a night elf doesn’t mean he needs to have a blazing blue soul underneath. In fact he likely has a green one being that he’s part demon and all that.
That has less to do with the Alliance and more to do with the people he’s most attached to.
Yes he might’ve jumped at the chance to help his brother and Tyrande, but then again maybe not because of their rejection of him. It’s hard to tell what’d he would do in those type of situations anyway. I do think he likely would, but it’s not like he would side with the Alliance after, at most he would help in the fight against the Horde in Darkshore and Ashenvale (perhaps maybe in Felwood).
I wouldn’t say those MMOs have more focus on the PC or their own characters and more just a different way of storytelling. From what I can tell, there isn’t much to those games either except maybe a bit more like choose Light and Dark side regardless of faction in SWOTR.
Both SWTOR’s and FFXIV’s story revolves ‘round the PC and his/her actions. Each cutscene and cinematic either depicts what the PC is doin’ or foreshadows where the PC is goin’ next. They rarely, if ever, give screen time to NPCs, unless it directly relates to the PC, 'cuz their stories are not 'bout the NPCs that BioWare and Squeenix write… the story is 'bout the PC.
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Yeah, I’ve played one of Swtor’s storymodes, I know how the focus is framed, but like I said it’s different not necessarily more or less. I’m not even saying that wow should completely stay the way it is, and that it’s perfect. I’m just saying that SWTOR and from what I’ve seen of FFXIV still has a weird obsession with shoving random characters down your throat as wow is.
This is true.