It’s part of the reason M+ is a cesspool of toxicity. If they took out the timer it would be a much nicer experience. Why does it still exist? I haven’t done a single M+ since BFA for this reason.
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The people who behave in a toxic manner are entirely responsible for their own behavior. Bullies blame their victims for forcing them to treat them badly.
There’s a timer because it keeps part of the population entertained by giving them something to do. It’s also there because the powers that be see it as a path to esports glory and a return to their (imagined) vision of the past when 100% of players were hypercompetitive and always did the hardest content in the game in guild groups.
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Blame AoE for this
In vanilla there’s not much point mass pulling since you can’t kill faster
Ah, so you must remember the good ol days when a slow Deadmines was easily over TWO HOURS LONG, an average run was OVER AN HOUR, and a fast run was A LITTLE BIT FASTER THAN AN HOUR. And let me not get started with Blackrock Depths.
Yeah, being an old school player in conversations like these with the framing you (and others) take makes your point irrelevant. Even more so with the existence of Classic realms.
Drop the entitled toxicity and go and play Classic if you want a painfully slow gameplay experience.
AoE should be celebrated because folks want to actually have fun with the game. Also, folks who frequently are blamed for said nearly 20 year old “Go-go-go” mentality (yes, the mentality originated back during Vanilla) are the only ones who use strategy, mechanics, CC, and more in dungeons anymore.
So yeah. AoE should be celebrated and this is such an old tired talking point by forum contrarians it isn’t even funny.
I played during Wrath, and I don’t recall speed running becoming a regular thing until people started getting ICC & ToC gear which was late in the Xpac.
Some of those pulls from Ahn’kahet: The Old Kingdom and parts of Pit of Saron were a wipe fest at the early on.
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Actually, it does.
You might want to sit your entitled little can down and listen.
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There’s cc and slower, methodical pulling in m0 (early in season) and m+
If tanks need a certain level of base mitigation to survive +10s with appropriate gear then normal and heroic will naturally never return to single pulls with multiple hard cc locking out half the pack because they won’t be dangerous.
M+ made it worse.
Yeah you can tell who actually didnt play in vanilla-wotlk lol
“Yeah bro we were pulling the entire dungeon to the first boss in tbc and wotlk dungeons, its been in the game forever”
Trying so hard to make it seem like this game hasnt devolved because of the way people run these dungeons.
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Yeah bro people were definitely pulling the entire dungeon to the first boss in wrath dungeons
Before they nerfed it, it was a delight watching people get absolutely bodied in TW Shattered Halls thinking they could pull whole rooms.
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It’s really starting to get to me too, what is wrong with you people these days? Don’t get me wrong it’s been bad for some time but it always seems to get worse and worse, not the other way around.
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To be fair it was ALWAYS like this, that’s what made Cata such a pain to deal with, nobody wanted to use CC or pull methodically in heroics.
M+ has just turned the dial up on it, and then low attention span generations that came after us made it worse.
To those saying there was speedrunning in heroics in Wrath: Yes, sort of, but not really. Not to this extent. Speedrunning heroics in Wrath was usually a well geared tank pulling 2-3 packs at a time if the healer and dps were comfortable with it.
And before the dungeon finder, finding a group was sometimes the hardest part, so people were a little more patient then because you needed patience to even get into a dungeon.
Plus since you’d only be grouping with players on your own server, there was more incentive to at least be respectful of your fellow players since being rude to them would make it harder for you to find groups in the future.
Even when dungeon finder came out near the end of wrath, people didn’t go go go through dungeons like they do nowadays.
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Yep, I was there in 08 , and people exaggerate big time how Wrath dungeons were blown through.
The “speed running” didn’t really happen until LFD came in, which by that point, people were super over geared for that content.
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And especially wasn’t this way at the start of Wrath.
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Which difficulty because the + 20 runner will say + 15 is a joke the + 15 will say + 10 is joke and so on and so forth … this is like Serral in Starcraft calling everybody Bad and everyone compared to him is bad but are they really bad for the content they are aiming to do 
This remind me of 10 man vs 25 mans where some boss are easier at 10 and some at 25. Why is that in this expansion that heroic dungeon is easier thatn follower dungeon but them some + 20 guy comes and say both are joke giving Blizzard a free pass on their poor work .
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The gogogogo meme is from Wotlk… 2008.
What do we think letting it run rampant for 16 years does?
lso, 10man is a joke. 25man is real raiding. Lich king had one valkyr lololol. Ensidia did nothing wrong.
The go-go-go playstyle is worse now because of how poorly Blizzard balanced Normal and Heroic dungeons (at least up until DF S4).
Players didn’t pull anywhere near as much or go as fast because it simply wasn’t feasible. IIRC, there is a larger item level difference in a single season of current WoW then there was in the entirety of Wrath, and with all the self-sustain tanks have nowadays, is it any wonder?
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I agree. I’ve thought it was really dumb to begin with and as time has gone on, it’s just proved me right. I like doing hard content but feeling like I have to do it even faster just puts a level of stress on me that feels unnecessary and redundant.