Anecdotal evidence that people(tanks in particular) are disproportionally unhappy with running Deadmines… as a tank, a large number of DM runs that I spawn into already have a group of people who are either standing around waiting for another tank to pop in, or have begun to clear what trash they can without one, using whatever CC is available to them. My assumption is that this isn’t just with tanks. But, as a tank, this is what I’m exposed to. I do not typically encounter this in other dungeons.
It’s obvious that a lot of work went into revamping this dungeon, and I doubt any dev who had a hand in it is thrilled with the response and the conflict happening over it on these forums. So, what are some possible solutions that don’t equate to a slap in their faces?
Skipping the entire role play is effectively scrapping a ton of work, and denies any player who hasn’t experienced the content the opportunity to. Personally, I really enjoyed the content initially. I assume I’m not the only one. “Everyone has already seen it a dozen times” is simply not the truth, which disqualifies it as a legitimate argument. Allowing it to be placed to an automated vote does the same thing in effect, or subjects the same people who are annoyed with it to doing it all over again.
Giving the option to blacklist it, or any other dungeon(I’m looking at you, SFK), undermines the entire meaning of “random” dungeon queue. It likely plays some kind of havoc on the queue system. It definitely reduces the chance that people actively seeking gear from there actually get it while queuing randoms.
Adding some kind of loot table to the RP seems like a possible solution to me. Something I personally would love… add a chest with some kind of loot that spawns at the end of the RP event if you zip through it below the 5 minute mark. Give that chest a small chance of containing something quite desirable.
Another potential solution, add a small amount of bonus valor for completing the RP in that 5 minute window.
Please chime in here with some constructive feedback. We’ve all seen enough complaints. Please offer some solutions, and help make this a post worth reading.
If people quit they quit, that is their choice. The dungeon is like 8 mins longer than the average instance.
edit: I don’t expect them to do anything with the instance, but if I could travel back in time I would tell the devs to remove roughly 50% of the trash.
If I’m a game designer, and I design a game with about ten dungeons, I understand that when I sit down to work on the task that inevitably, players are going to rank order the dungeons from their favorite to their least favorite. I also understand that a small group will be very vocal about the dungeon at the bottom of that list, and I can also predict that the one at the bottom will be the one that is the hardest or the one that gives the fewest rewards per unit of time spent, or in other words, the least efficient.
The final thing I know is that if I do something to shore up the one at the bottom or the tenth, the complaints will simply move to the ninth, despite it’s distance on the list from the tenth. Here you see the plight of the designer, especially when complaints are largely of the quantitative rather than the qualitative sort.
The obvious solution is to just add a blacklist option. If people across the board end up choosing deadmines well that’ a pretty solid indictment that there’s a problem with the dungeon. And either way that’s a win win since most people have a dungeon they don’t like for whatever reason.
Another obvious solution would be to just remove the VP reward from completing an RDF. Changing it to VP per boss instead would work(and that would help other dungeons where people skip bosses). Or just make it a repeatable quest like the H+ rewards in wrath were.
I think the Blacklist is fine in theory, but if the skew is really that far towards a particular dungeon you’d likely have a behavior problem.
Not everyone would turn on the blacklist, but then still drop when it pops. Particularly if that is a tank/healer, and most tank/healers have it listed, you’ve got a party stranded that’s going to wait a long time for a replacement.
Solution #2 (spreading out VP to bosses or to a final boss in some measure, or tying it to a daily quest, etc.) would take us back to something like the end of wrath where everyone just queues the best/most efficient dungeon, which has significant downside, but is probably still superior.
Imagine if they made a raid and the first boss mechanic was literally “chill out for 5 minutes” it would never get cleared because people can’t even do that in heroics.
Right, just let bad design go untouched, and be apathetic. That’s the way!
Any dungeon that folks instantly jump queue for is likely an issue lol.
The trash is kinda fun, as it’s just large packs, which people love. But all the aspects that happen when you get to the ship basically grind it all to a halt.
Actually, I think voicing our own opinions is the way. You may disagree, and that’s fine, but your opinion that it is bad design is like just your opinion man…
The TDEC is aware of a small number of noisemakers trying to argue as though the game should change to accommodate them, rather than those who are enjoying it as it is…
This isnt true at all. I would consider myself a pretty above average to good player, and I hate DM. The time vs reward of the dungeon is garbage. The forced 10 minutes of RP at the end is garbage. Between the mist, then the poison, then the scripted boat stuff with the 2 rounds of fire, it just drags the dungeon out way longer than needed.
It was cool the first time, after that not so much.
the dungeon is fine its just the last 2 bosses are dumb AF. % based boss mechanics like this are really tilting. Same thing in HoO. The last boss blizz should have just removed that cringy “gauntlet”
This is an unsolvable riddle for Blizzard, probably.
No solution we can present will satisfy all parties and each solution will have its own group of players that will be discontent with the change.
They could make the RP optional, which would gate those who want the achievement from completing it.
They could make the dungeon give 1.5x valor reward, which would incentivize running it since efficiency wise it would be roughly on-par with other dungeons.
They could remove the pseudo immunity on the bosses where it’s relevant to accelerate the pacing of the dungeon.
