Yep. Sorta can’t believe how many people say “warlocks” when they mean one spec of warlock.
What the hell are you smoking??
Retribution is overpowered as hell right now.
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Skill issue.
I respectfully disagree. 
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Thats quite the tone shift in the conversation, but ill accept an agree to disagree.
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I apologize for that earlier comment.
Too often Forum debates devolve into unnecessary arguments that are not constructive.
Also, on a side note, how did the focus of this thread turn to Ret Paladins? 
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A great many people are upset with the current state of Ret and feel its hurtin casters (about time something stopped casters tbh).
Most threads devolve into Anti-(insert melee that stops casters from running the entire game here) in my experience.
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Couple things.
- Your fire mage is lvl 68. You don’t have a warlock, ele shaman, or boomchicken.
- You are constantly on these forums pushing a narrative of a caster meta. It’s clear that you are in this thread downplaying the OPness of melee and ret in general, while upselling the caster experience. Worth noting that your max level character are a Death Knight, Warrior, and a Paladin.
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Youre silly! My fire mage is now arcane, but is max, My Boomkin has been 70 longer than any character i have minus my dk, and my elemental shaman is also 70. You fact checkers are bad at this
Its almost like there is one! sorry i had to add this in edit, i was distracted by being told i dont have my characters
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That’s a lot of words to be incredibly wrong
Pretty sure I’ve played with Anas boomy more than you’ve ever even PvPed xD
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Ah Congrats on dinging a couple of days ago! I see those extra days in max lvl PvP has given on a wealth of knowledge to speak on Casters at max level.
Check PvP is usually fairly accurate but can still be wrong. Regardless. A source says you only have 1 caster that just dinged while some other person on the forums says that they are “pretty sure” they’ve seen a boomkin. I like to go based on what I know, instead of what I’m being told. You state you have several max-level toons that are casters. Check PvP says otherwise, that coupled with your very surface-level knowledge of most caster classes. It just doesn’t look good, ya know?
It’s like 20 words, but I respect your attempt to be witty.
Neither of you seem to be addressing this however,
You and Tide were the only two pushing this idea. No one else seems to share these thoughts.
Very few people like arguing against the echo chamber that is the wow forums, i get tired of it myself tbh.
Sure, and you see that in these anti-premade threads. However, there isn’t anything to support a caster meta. No threads, no youtube videos, no twitch steamers. There’s nothing. You aren’t arguing against an echo chamber, you’re just plain wrong.
Ya know, when it is everywhere that people are calling it the melee season, as well as everyone saying ret and arms are overtuned, AND all data shows arms and rets polluting the ranks, and when bg team’s melee consists of mostly arms and rets, maybe YOU are just being contrarian because you have those specs?
It’s not an “echo chamber” just because you’re contrarian.
Man do i hear an echo in here or what
Let’s ignore the caster meta stuff then. Let’s address this shall we?
I do this calc to try and figure out what is actually powerful, it’s a listing of the fraction of players in RSS that make it to >2700. I think it’s a good representation of the meta but with the usual caveat that we’re discussing BGs where certain specs have an advantage compared to RSS. It’s still interesting, only takes a couple of minutes to whip up.
| Total | >2700 | Percent | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Demonology | Warlock | 7789 | 469 | 6.02% |
| Retribution | Paladin | 13776 | 828 | 6.01% |
| Beast Mastery | Hunter | 9290 | 413 | 4.45% |
| Arms | Warrior | 12571 | 435 | 3.46% |
| Restoration | Shaman | 9028 | 299 | 3.31% |
| Mistweaver | Monk | 9206 | 300 | 3.26% |
| Discipline | Priest | 11885 | 362 | 3.05% |
| Assassination | Rogue | 10277 | 278 | 2.71% |
| Elemental | Shaman | 8499 | 221 | 2.60% |
| Destruction | Warlock | 8103 | 210 | 2.59% |
| Shadow | Priest | 8684 | 218 | 2.51% |
| Restoration | Druid | 9591 | 236 | 2.46% |
| Havoc | Demon Hunter | 11066 | 264 | 2.39% |
| Windwalker | Monk | 9584 | 218 | 2.27% |
| Feral | Druid | 8774 | 195 | 2.22% |
| Holy | Paladin | 5929 | 126 | 2.13% |
| Holy | Priest | 4500 | 89 | 1.98% |
| Subtlety | Rogue | 9182 | 180 | 1.96% |
| Balance | Druid | 8455 | 163 | 1.93% |
| Affliction | Warlock | 4772 | 84 | 1.76% |
| Survival | Hunter | 5865 | 99 | 1.69% |
| Marksmanship | Hunter | 7910 | 121 | 1.53% |
| Preservation | Evoker | 9800 | 145 | 1.48% |
| Arcane | Mage | 4819 | 68 | 1.41% |
| Frost | Mage | 11955 | 157 | 1.31% |
| Enhancement | Shaman | 7850 | 93 | 1.18% |
| Fire | Mage | 4537 | 51 | 1.12% |
| Unholy | Death Knight | 10023 | 102 | 1.02% |
| Fury | Warrior | 5731 | 45 | 0.79% |
| Frost | Death Knight | 6615 | 49 | 0.74% |
| Devastation | Evoker | 9031 | 55 | 0.61% |
| Outlaw | Rogue | 5644 | 30 | 0.53% |
| Blood | Death Knight | 2306 | 9 | 0.39% |
| Protection | Warrior | 2564 | 10 | 0.39% |
| Brewmaster | Monk | 1266 | 4 | 0.32% |
| Vengeance | Demon Hunter | 1445 | 4 | 0.28% |
| Protection | Paladin | 3398 | 6 | 0.18% |
| Guardian | Druid | 3943 | 5 | 0.13% |
| Total | 285663 | 6641 | 2.32% |
~https://www.pvpleaderboard.com/statistics/all/all/2700#spec
EDIT: I did some additional calcs from the data.
| Ranged | Melee | Heal | Tank | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2323 | 101694 | 3372 | 134394 | 1557 | 59939 | 38 | 14922 |
| 34.98% | 2.28% | 50.78% | 2.51% | 23.45% | 2.60% | 0.57% | 0.25% |
The first higher number is the percent above 2700 for the 4 roles while the second is normalizing to the number of people total playing each role. If you put the tank numbers with the melee, there’s exactly 2.28% of the population of both melee and ranged >2700. Essentially, no power difference though you have some specs that perform better.
Also note, dps to healer ratio in terms of account is 3.15:1 (including tanks) and it needs to be 2:1 based on role call. Need 25% more healers.
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What would you like me to say about it? Check pvp said for a long time i wasnt rival on my warrior despite me having had the gear transmogged, it is apparently not showing multiple of my toons.
I’ve found its rarely accurate.
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There’s already hard data showing the ranks of the top 1000. https://drustvar.com/leaderboard/stats/us/3v3?top=1000
You can check all, last week, last 2 weeks. What does it show?
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I find that list to be fairly accurate in my limited experience.
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