AOTC guilds dont even require 4s people just come in whatever gear they want from the looks of the key they ran he was a 584 rogue getting carried all the rest had timed 4s or higher and were 1500 io to 2300 io the 2300 was a 624 hunter who hasn’t failed that key in like 5 weeks the other three were at least 615 chances are rogue kept wiping them
The changes to m+ this season were dookie, but a 4 in a guild group? That’s totally a skill issue at this point unless you’re all freshly dinged sub 600 ilvl. Mechanics, defensives, and interrupts. Learn them, use them, preach them.
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A plus 4 is what used to be a plus 8.
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I had a heroic guild trying to be a mythic guild tell me starting November 20th I would be required to do one ten key a week and 1 delve at 8 or higher.
I was like why are people having to do delves for irrelevant gear.
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quit that guild they suck. I been casually pugging 4/8 Mythic every week, takes about 1.5 hours once a week. Never settle for heroic guilds. PUGs had AOTC cleared week 1.
Yeah, they reworked the M+ progression back in season 4 of DF. M0 has better rewards and takes the place of old 0-10 and the old 20 became the new 10. Basically add 10 to any current key to get the equivalent of what it was before the rework.
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That was before war within. Now we can just gear up by delves. We are not required anymore to do mythic +
Depends on the content.
Next statement for m+ from Blizz will be them banning players for not enjoying it 
I never joined. I was laughing so hard I didn’t even respond to their DM.
They deleted the first 10 key levels from the old system. A 4 is now an old 14.
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Took me 200 some tries to get heroic queen down as a pug before she was nerfed. 
I still see people struggling on it.
Pugs are terrible at queen unless they already done it before.
This is the only boss in that raid I understand people searching for AoTC when making a group.
How does that even work, does this count in the ilvl increase by like hundred or so?
I was absent the day they voted on destroying M+
So was my proxy.
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M0’s now give rewards equivalent to a +10 in the old system. They felt there were too many key levels and that many of them were ignored because of loot breakpoints (and they were). So now a +2 is basically a +12 in the old system because M0 covers the old 1-10.
Thank you I kind of understand how it works but i dont understand how we know exactly that its the same diff since different dungeons, higher ilvl etc. I thought scaling was noticable only in DF after changes.
I’m confused… what guild requires m+ but can’t time a 4?
that’s just so bizarre
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I’d say this is a chatGPT ahh reply as an attempt at a dunk, but even the knockoff LLM’s would at least use the right “you’re”.
Not if you ordered them to use the improper form to pass something off as genuine.