Exactly. The OPs problem is that he can not seem to separate his opinions from facts. The fact is that, though there are guilds that will run things the way he is proposing, most would just consider his whinging elitism that isnt worth their time and put him on their ignore lists.
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Play what you want. If you don’t care to be world top then what does it matter? Towards the end of Legion I actually started seeking out the casual raid guilds that didn’t care how people played and simply enjoyed raiding at a slow pace. There will be these guilds in Classic as well. Every class in Classic generally brings something to the table, even if they arent optimal they will still help bring success to the group.
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its kind of like using a screw as a nail.
Reminder: These are 40man raids. Its better to raid with full 40 than to go 38 or even 39. A LOT of people PUG 1-5 spots in their raids. Usually snagging people from pvp guilds and they are petty and don’t change specs. SO a vast majority of raids consisted of a small percentage of “less than ideal” specs just to fill spots.
All I’m saying is play what you want and don’t expect anything and you will be surprised.
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And someone just might like boomkin enough that they can deal with the dead OOM time. Do you not get that?
You simply don’t have to understand why someone might enjoy that anymore than I need to understand why people think warriors are fun. (I love you warriors but no matter how many times I try to play warrior I just can’t get into it.)
What does that have to do with it? If someone wants serious progression raiding they will prioritize that desire and spec accordingly (whether Meta is a more engaging spec or not). Someone who prioritizes what they enjoy playing over progression won’t likely be in progression focused guild anyway.
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Ok well apparently this forum isn’t for discussing potential flaws that existed in the game. You’re only allowed to gush and be inclusive, which is funny because I was never trying to exclude anyone, but heaven forbid I maybe claim that certain specs weren’t designed well or were barely functional. Everything in vanilla was just perfect. It is we who are fallible as humans.
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At least you arent going to be overly dramatic about getting static for making poorly thought out and blanket statements…
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Or it’s about telling people to just play the game to have fun… Join our Raid and let’s go fight some stuff and enjoy ourselves and not over complicate everything.
Not everyone is about min-maxing and looking at other players as numbers/statistics.
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People know this already. What they are trying to tell you is despite this it doesn’t matter. Just play and have fun how you want.
Some people enjoy trying to do things they are supposed to not be able to do. I know I was one of them back then. Sometimes it doesn’t work, sometimes it’s not what you thought it would be, but it was still fun.
Not everything has to work perfectly for people to enjoy things.
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The argument that it’s okay to take people who don’t spec properly because early raids were so easy they could have a few AFK’s isn’t really a compelling argument.
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Exactly. So do we carry a few people we don’t need or do we clear the raid and divide the loot among fewer people?
Guess which option guilds are going to choose.
Right? Or that one guy talking about the hunter AFKing for all of Rag and still getting the kill? Like, that’s cool and all, but I don’t see how that makes a compelling argument against?
As if the fact that you can get away with it makes it ok that you don’t get to play your class for half the fight because you’re oom? I mean if that’s not an issue for you more power to you but to me that’s a pretty significant problem, but what do I know it’s not like I afk’d BGs for honor and then complain later that all the gear I got didn’t make me auto-pwn because I decided to watch “The Office” while /sitting in WSG instead of learning how to fight classes.
And now all the people defending afk’ing in BGs are gonna come. What have I done? lol
My most memorable and fun experiences in WoW have been in groups with weird specs and make ups because people actually have to use their heads instead of just following x spec, y group composition, and z method because someone on youtube told them that was the “optimal” way to complete the content.
Min/Maxers can min/max all they want, and decide who they want in their guild/group/raid, but telling anyone else how to play is just stupid. It’s a game. It should be played for fun. If people want to pick crazy specs and spend all day trying and failing, let them.
If you enter a maze with exact directions showing how to get to through it, there is no accomplishment and in my opinion, no point in entering at all.
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I’d let you in my guild.
You can play what you want, too. Doesn’t mean you’ll qualify for the raid team.
You see, you have your logic all fussed.
If you want to raid, it’s likely you’ll want to play as frost spec so you can actually do reasonable damage in the raid because you want to prove your worth getting phat lewts. Pure DPS classes tend to be very competitive on the meters. You’re going to sit there and say someone who is competitive minded is going to play a spec that doesn’t really work?
Yeah right.
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Still waiting for an answer here.
I was lucky that back then I had a guy that also played Paladin and he basically encouraged me to try different things. We would run 5 mans with me tanking and him healing, UBRS, heck I even did some offtanking in ZG because he wanted to see if we could pull it off.
We did that in our off time basically. When it came to the real stuff we would swap to Holy and do our thing, because we wanted to be sure to get a group. That mindset would eventually lead to me getting an offer from a server first guild, which I declined, but still got invites to AQ40 if they needed someone.
It was all fun.
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This pretty much sums it up. I have no issue with people like the latter, but I would never wish to play with them. It sounds so damn unfun.
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Why on earth do people care how other raids fill their spots? You want your hardcore elitist guild? Go for it. Enjoy your server firsts. I enjoyed watching the competition between the top few guilds on our server. You want to let in less desirable specs? Go for it. Have fun.
This reminds me of when we had MC on farm and we finally got Eye of Sulfuras to drop. We were short a few ingots and went to other guilds that had extras or felt like they were unlikely to be able to do anything with them and purchased them. I think one of the guilds that we bought one from did it on the condition that we helped their main holy priest get Benediction by letting them come to our Rag kill and loot the Eye of Divinity. All of our priests already had completed the quest so I did it.
Afterward seeing it as a way to raise some money for the guild and help some people out I offered Eye of Divinity drops for a price. Priest lead of the number one guild freaked tf out on the forums. Saying it was wrong and they didn’t deserve the weapon because their guilds hadn’t earned it. Blah blah blah. I think most of the server forum turned against him for being such an elitist snob and he ended up apologizing for it.
It isn’t real life. It is just a game. Let people have their fun if it isn’t at the expense of your fun. I sometimes raided with less than ideal raiders because I liked their company (this wasn’t always perfect and there were sometimes problems about it and disgruntled people but you just deal with it on a case by case basis).
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I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that I don’t really think any serious guilds would take things like a Boomkin or Ret Paladin for AQ40 or Naxx progression. They could take another Mage/Lock or a Warrior DPS instead. You’d probably be told you’re going as a healer in cookie cutter spec or just not coming to the raid.
That is if the guild actually wanted to clear the higher end progression content that’s post-BWL.
Nevermind specs that are just not built correctly (Specs that have talents just all over and don’t synergize with anything at all.)
Molten Core where it can be expected to be cleared easily with 20-25 great players or less and the rest of the raid can be whatever? Sure, go ahead.
I mean players can do whatever they want with their guilds. MC/ZG/Ony isn’t really difficult. Though once you hit BWL and onwards you can’t really claim that you can do whatever you want and still clear the content without getting carried by players who outgear it.
You can be as noninclusive as you want. Nobody is saying a serious progression guild has to take a non-meta spec. Nobody is saying you have invite someone with a non-meta spec. Classic is great because you have complete control over who you group with and can customize your experience more and more as you meet people on your server and find more like minded individuals.
But people are also completely welcome to play whatever they like if they don’t care about meeting the requirements to play with you. shrug
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