I enjoy playing tank in PvE and PvP and in BG Blitz I feel absolutely useless. The moment a MM hunter spots me, I’m guarenteed dead despite self healing or having a healer on me.
Meanwhile a mistweaver monk does every task I can do 10 times better and while doing so tops up his entire teams healthpool.
Not to mention, the moment you even queue tank in bg blitz or random bgs, there are instant toxicity whispers from fellow players.
I’ll probably catch a lot of hate for this as usual, because the moment you have an opinion that isn’t mainstream, the World of Warcraft forums will scold you for it. Fascists.
Anyway. Blizz, take this as feedback. Make Tanks Great Again, thanks.
It depends on the tank you’re playing. In PvP they definitely aren’t all made equal. I have a blast on my warrior, I also see DKs in god mode. Guardian is respectable, DH can be in a good players hands as well. BrM and Prot Pally are a comical joke though.
I did a game on my prot warrior yesterday, spun the flag in BFG for the entire game and ended up with 600M damage and 850m healing done by the end of it. Sadly we still lost because although I was keeping 3-6 people busy on my node with little to no support, the rest of the team was incapable of taking another base (which is funny because they did complain at the start that I was a tank but ended up being MVP all game)
I play mostly DH. And carrying the flag can be fun. But honestly, the moment a MM hunter looks at me, 35000-40000K health is a joke. Same goes for a lot of other classes.
It’s just be nice if tank filled their roles again. A lot of healers don’t even like being forced into a flag carrier role, I noticed.
And tanks don’t need to be overpowered. But at least give them a little bit more survivability in PvP… or just nerf the damage on classes. Now I’m curious what Midnight will bring with the ability pruning and the damage being more spread out rather than big burst damage. But here’s my attempt to ensure that Blizzard actually looks at tanks as well in PvP, if they look at PvP at all.
Problem with tanks is they ruin the fun of everyone else. I’m good to have the 1 person who wants to play a tank unhappy over the entire rest of the team having to be upset because tanks don’t die
In other words, Tanks should be doing more damage in PVP - I agree.
In all fairness, seeing as Tanks take an extra ~60% increased damage in PVP, shouldn’t they be doing an extra ~60% increased damage in PVP to compensate? I mean, if you gut their survivability in PVP, but give them nothing to compensate for it, is it really surprising that Tanks struggle to contribute?
Except that they do die - and far too easily, I might add. They don’t exactly feel like a “Tank” when they just flop to certain classes.
As per what “People” want: most “People” are idiots and want contradictory things. On the one hand, when they’re facing a Tank, they want Tanks to be made of paper and hit like wet noodles; on the other hand, when a Tank is on their team, they want Tanks to actually contribute something. Either way, the “People” will be upset because they want contradictory things.
You edited my post to make it seem like I meant “tanks don’t die”. That isn’t at all what I was saying, I’m saying hypothetically if tanks don’t die then everyone who isn’t playing a tank have less fun in this game
Unrelated to the above though we have to address what you said, and I quote:
Oh you poor thing, quoting me and leaving out the rest of the sentence, again, isn’t going to hammer home that you’re right. Anyone can snip 3 words out of a sentence and make it mean something that wasn’t intended. Quoting the whole sentence and making those 3 words bold doesn’t change what I meant.
Scenario 1: have the 1 person who wants to play a tank unhappy
Scenario 2: the entire rest of the team having to be upset because tanks don’t die
OP was complaining about the scenario 1, the current state of the game. I said I much prefer that than scenario 2
Hypothetically, you could have understood it better and realized that I never said the game is currently in a state where tanks don’t die.
Hypothetically, you could have not edited my post to only 3 words and replied to it.
if you go look at tank changes in the last (all) years they basically get blanket nerfed with no reprieve. any time anything is even remotely playable, atp an accident, by the next patch its being nerfed.
as long as the majority of the player base refuses to learn anything about tanks , blizz is just going to keep them out of the game. which i won’t say is the wrong thing to do, because at the end of the day the game needs to be balanced around the majority, but its definitely not fun if you’re a tank main its just a reality, and its sad an entire role is excluded from a mini game
especially when there are probably more tank mains in all of WoW than the entire population of pvp…
If you can’t see the three quotes I posted (including the full context), then I don’t know how to help you. I can’t see for you.
This is a gross over-simplification of the problem, treating it as if the only possible fix to Tanks was increased survivability (to the point that they don’t die).
This is also probably why I misunderstood you. I didn’t think that you meant what was obviously an over-simplification, but here we are…
I understand it now, and it’s… well, not worth understanding. You’re over-simplifying and treating it as if there was only 2 possible scenarios, without any nuance.
You also missed my point concerning contradictory wants in your knee-jerk reaction. The point is especially important taken in the context of your proposed (hypothetical) scenarios, because - even in your first scenario - Tanks being in a bad spot might also make the whole team upset anyways, regardless of their personal opinions about Tanks in PVP. If a Tank (on your team) is having a bad time (due to Tanks being dogwater in PVP), your team might also be in for a bad time simply because he’s there. In other words, even the first scenario isn’t ideal.
The problem with your scenarios is that you’re only looking at the problem from one angle - i.e.: Tank as enemy, and not Tank as friendly. While it may be beneficial for them to be weak (and useless) when they’re an enemy, it is not beneficial for them to be weak (and useless) as a friendly.
People want weak Tanks, and then complain about their inability to do anything when they inevitably wind up on their team.
That’s what YOU asked for!!!
It sucks for everyone.
Tanks need help. This is simply stating a fact. That said, I’m not implying that the only way, or even the best way, to help them is increased survivability. For instance, they could just opt to compensate with a buff to overall damage. That is probably the laziest (temporary) fix, but it would at least be something. Make it feel less like a Tank is just dead-weight outside of niche situations.
I did see it, and addressed it. I did, however, edit my post like 30 seconds after I posted it but considering you replied 40 minutes later I have to assume you saw my edit and still replied with this lol
I didn’t propose a fix and neither did OP. He made a statement, and I stated I prefer how it is now over the alternative. The alternative is what’s already happened, near unkillable tanks. This happened in SL, it was awful.
You can make up fixes all you like, so long as you don’t edit my posts taking out everything but 3 words so that you can argue a point I’m not making
And if only you had understood it earlier, you wouldn’t have replied to me at all, let alone reply while editing out my whole post and leaving in only 3 words so you could argue
Again, I’m treating it as the 2 scenarios that HAVE happened, not your made up 3rd scenario that isn’t a thing. I wasn’t replying to you, you replied to me
No, you replied to me first. You missed my point entirely which is tanks are not fun to play against. Even right now, they are not fun to play against. Making them tankier does not solve this. I said they ruin everyone else’s fun, you replied telling me that tanks ARE killable
Yeah…I know…I addressed this already. In my first post.
…that you replied to… a bunch of times, ignoring everything I said and highlighting 3 words repeatedly
I prefer the scenario where tanks are bad over the scenario where they’re good because then there are less of them to ruin the fun of everyone else. This includes tanks on my team. This includes tanks on the other team. This includes all tanks in all games.
Crazy you aren’t understanding this, it was in the first sentence of the post you replied to and mostly ignored
This was was my overall point. The first sentence
I actually think that’s you.
“Tanks being better is better for everyone”??
Tanks being good means more people play tanks, which means we have a higher tank population queuing which means, inevitably, you’ll have to face more tanks.
No thanks, give me weak tanks on my team any day of the week as long as tanks are bad
False. We want no tanks, not so long as their only purpose is to annoy
Only tanks are asking for this lol
Yes, and whatever they get their “annoying” factor needs to be taken down from a 10 to a 5 to be in line with everyone else. That’s all they’re good for right now. kidnaping healers, knockbacks, throws and CC
Find your solution, I don’t care. Present ideas, theorycraft all you want. Just stop replying to me with my own quote taken out of context, you completely misunderstood my original post
The problem with tanks in pvp is there is no happy medium. They either can’t die, or they only die. They will never be able to adjust tanks in a way where they are meaningful without being OP.
They need to just pull the plug and upset the 7 people who enjoy tanks in rated pvp and just tell them no, sorry, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
Uh oh!! Look what’s hidden in Tumble’s post! If you look really close he saying tanks can’t die. Quick Taeles come argue with him. Tell him he’s wrong and ignoring all your points
There are a couple tanks that redirect/support pretty decently built into their PvP kits. pallies, warriors, Druids and monks have a few options to redirect damage, heal damage on allies, disrupt and CC. The main problem is most casual pvpers have no clue how to effectively use a tank’s entire toolkit and just wanna zug zug like they are a dps which leads to suboptimal gameplay and results in people seeing no value in a tank being in a BG. The few really good ones out there end up causing people to scream for nerfs to tanks even though 90%+ of PvP tanks suck lol.
