Survival needs to stay!

[Vaelys-heartseeker]

PvE/Raiding tends to favor ranged?

[Spinnerdh-the-underbog]

@Rahkeetahp-aerie-peak

SV should be more focused on ME abilities, including melee attacks and cool contraptions, maybe.

What do you think of my redesign for it here:

Potential design for four spec Hunter, ALL spells/abilities/talents, and how to make pets engaging again

Many Hunter players are in agreement that the state of the Hunter class is not very good, so just as I did with my thread specifically about a ranged Survival spec, I will make this thread with the intention of detailing the Hunter class as a whole; possible changes that could be made to the general class, specs and pets, in order to make the Hunter class more engaging and to better fulfill its class fantasy. I will include four specs in this post; Beast Mastery, Marksmanship, Ranged Survival (S…

[Ghorak-laughing-skull]

@Azagorod-emerald-dream

They dont need ideas or such, they already have a huge amount within the buisness. And if they want feedback on something, they will ask it via ingame on beta or via specific thread on forum. Certainly not class forums or gen chat.

They specifically created these forums to allow for feedback and discussions regarding the game.

[Bepples-barthilas]

@Bushwacker-sargeras

The relationship between you and your pet makes it like a tag team event.

We already have a spec that does this. We do not need ranged BM and melee BM.

@Charlone-hyjal

It was easier to play than MM was, and a lot of people just don’t like BM.

There was minimal difficulty difference between MM and BM.

You are trying to be diplomatic here but you instead come across as extremely patronising.

@Charlone-hyjal

I’m guessing most hunters weren’t around when our 31 point SV talent was Lacerate. They were definitely trying to go for a melee hunter deal even way back then.

No, no they weren’t. They were trying to offer a spec that wasn’t as useless when stuck within the minimum range with many tools to get back to ranged. The class was very much centred around ranged weapons and this is indicated both explicitly in their written material and implicitly through the design of the class. A Hunter without a ranged weapon and sticking to melee range whenever possible was absolutely never an intended style of the class, even in the earliest days with Lacerate.

@Charlone-hyjal

They just didn’t know how to do it, so it came out being absolutely awful.

What exactly was so difficult to understand about “An ability doing 6 DPS is far too low”? The real answer is that the entire Suvival tree on release was unfinished, untested, unattended, and not indicative of any grand design direction. It certainly wasn’t indicative of an attempt to make a melee Hunter the likes of which we see in Legion because the class came with a ranged weapon, ranged-favouring stat weights, and ranged-favouring toolkit design, as well as written material (WoW manual) that says the class is unique specifically due to its use of ranged weapons.

@Charlone-hyjal

I hope they tweak the other specs enough so that the old SV fans will enjoy them as well.

TL;DR “Not in my back yard”

@Azagorod-emerald-dream

No, a BM uses the pet, orders it. The pet does nearly all the work. The hunter is more of a support there. The SV works with the pet, tag team as said.

This will always be a terrible argument for as long as Survival is using a spell called Kill Command; a spell belonging to BM, no less.

Renaming Bestial Wrath to Coordinated Assault doesn’t suddenly change it to a totally different approach to pets. What SV does with pets is the same as what BM does with pets, with the exception of Spirit Bond which is stolen from BM.

@Azagorod-emerald-dream

Low rep on the PvE side
High rep on the PvP side

Far, far more people participate in PvE than rated PvP.

@Darkeforge-proudmoore

WoW’s been dying for 15 years according to certain “customers” and since you play hunter below an lfr level, your feedback isn’t worth the time you take to write it.

I play a Hunter at 12/12 mythic level. So I’ll use my super-worth-the-time opinion to declare what Dawnspirit said with extra validity (according to you):

“And not listening to your players and paying customers is the quickest way to fail. Nothing is too large to fail.”

[Darkeforge-proudmoore]

The four or five of you whining on the forums every single day don’t represent the playerbase.

[Yurah-pagle]

the irony lol

[Spinnerdh-the-underbog]

Do we need to have another discussion about focus groups?

[Andrastelle-skywall]

Survival is the only hunter spec I enjoy.

Edit: I am sure if there was a dark ranger skin for blood elf id probably make another hunter that uses a bow though.

[Dawnspirit-wyrmrest-accord]

Glad you enjoy it. Would you be opposed to letting RSV come back as a 4th spec?

[Avestan-arthas]

Completely agree. Just wish they would work on making it feel better. I miss a lot of what made it fun in legion. It bewilders me that they havent made mongoose bite baseline. I saw a suggestion that they swap out kill command with flanking strike, kind of how it was in legion which i completely agree with. Why would i command my pet to attack while we are both standing ontop of the enemy? just stab it. the pet will get the idea.

Also miss having fury of the eagle. Was a nice finisher to a well managed mongoose bite window.

[Androgynous-lightbringer]

I honestly don’t know why you guys respond to darkforge, all he does in the hunter forum is troll.

[Endar-alterac-mountains]

if you go on radier io’s website you can see that survival is the lowest played spec out of any of the other classes at all key levels

[Yurah-pagle]

he will just tell you that data doesn’t matter and there are millions of SV hunters we don’t know about

[Darkeforge-proudmoore]

Actually it’s Sub rogue, and aff locks are barely ahead of SV, but please continue …

[Spinnerdh-the-underbog]

Right, so melee SV is the second least played spec in the game. What was your argument again? That melee SV is very popular and how we here on the Hunter forums are in the ‘minority’?

[Worgunz-emerald-dream]

Survival hunter needs to go back to being a ranged spec, or they need to make it more melee again like in Legion. The hand crossbow thing looks dumb as hell, and the spec is a confused mess.

[Dawnspirit-wyrmrest-accord]

Getting rid of it completely is probably a bad move at this point. Bringing back RSV as a 4th spec and making survival mainly melee focused is probably the most sensible solution at this point.

[Darkeforge-proudmoore]

You realize there is always going to be someone at or near the bottom right? Using your logic, MM should be gutted since no one plays that either. BM is far and away the preferred spec. By the way, of course SV is low. It’s competing against havoc and outlaw, and throw in unholy if groups can pull around the dk.

You’ll be gone soon enough. SV is staying melee in Shadowlands and you’ll fade off once launch gets here.

[Worgunz-emerald-dream]

Survival has been low multiple expansions, and more people still play MM than survival, even though survival does better damage. BM is one of the most popular specs even when it’s not very good.

You also bring up the issues that it’s competing against other melee specs, this is an even better reason to revert it back to ranged. Lots of people already play melee, it’s over-saturated.

[Spinnerdh-the-underbog]

@Darkeforge-proudmoore

You realize there is always going to be someone at or near the bottom right? Using your logic, MM should be gutted since no one plays that either.

I don’t think any class/spec should be gutted or should have been gutted. Have you already forgotten that we don’t want new Survival to be removed, but rather that we just want ranged SV returned? Showing that new Survival isn’t nearly as popular as you implied was just to show that Blizzard’s decision to delete ranged SV was an unpopular one, and that there is plenty of reason to return ranged SV.