Stop throwing gear around and rewarding mindless play

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

Mythic players got their own thing, it’s normal and heroic raiders who get dunked on by these changes.

Funny, I am a heroic raider and I am not getting dunked on.

[Burkkins-moon-guard]

Which is exactly the same situation we have right now. And it’s one Blizzard likes. They are perfectly fine with the raiders getting gear first, taking advantage of it for a few months, and the rest of the playerbase catching up towards the end of the tier through time gated rewards.

Do tell me what the point is then, if everyone just catches up in a month or two, why go hard road when you can wait it out and catch up yourself? The game has become shell of it’s former self.

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

The game has become shell of it’s former self.

Which expansion did you figure this out in?

[Avagon-sisters-of-elune]

Do tell me what the point is then, if everyone just catches up in a month or two, why go hard road when you can wait it out and catch up yourself? The game has become shell of it’s former self.

Because its fun? What other answer is there?

Which expansion did you figure this out in?

lol, I figured it out back in EQ personally, maybe Burkkins is a little slow

[Kydrav-bleeding-hollow]

It’s more about being dedicated to keep doing them. And the extreme time-gating is what balances out the ease of content. You’re acting like the ease of content is the only deciding factor that could ever possibly be considered.

And again, the ENTIRE POINT of this thread was that I feel gear should be rewarded based on difficulty not time spent or repeated action of easy content.

It does matter. The people doing harder content will be rewarded for doing that content. And if people aren’t doing that harder content, they will more quickly run into a wall where they have to rely on luck to keep going. What you want is for that wall to occur the second a player hits 120.

What I want is a wall that SHOULD happen if you don’t attempt more difficult content, yes.

Don’t do more difficult content, don’t get the better gear it’s as simple as that.

[Terranox-stonemaul (Terranox)]

How so? If you got more raiders you got more players to que with and more people to push mythics? But I doubt the community would welcome players without achievements. The decline of raiders is due to higher barriers of entry. In Wotlk you had gear that was equivalent to normal raids on vendors. And doing the heroics was easy with the overgearing.

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

I figured it out back in EQ personally

WoW was touted as the casual gamer’s MMO when I moved to it from EQ.

[Rankin-shandris (Rankin)]

And again, the ENTIRE POINT of this thread was that I feel gear should be rewarded based on difficulty not time spent or repeated action of easy content.

Gear is being rewarded based on difficulty. You’re just posting because the gap isn’t as wide as you want it to be. And overall average item level is what really matters, not just a person getting lucky with one or two slots.

What I want is a wall that SHOULD happen if you don’t attempt more difficult content, yes.

And that wall exists, it’s just not where you want it to be.

[Burkkins-moon-guard]

Which expansion did you figure this out in?

Started somewhere around the frosty boy dying. You know, when they added queued dungeons, queued raid, queued everything. Then sharding, crossrealm, just killed the feeling of the world. But raids remained, and now they killed that too by removing tier sets and throwing free gear at players.

[Avagon-sisters-of-elune]

What I want is a wall that SHOULD happen if you don’t attempt more difficult content, yes.

Don’t do more difficult content, don’t get the better gear it’s as simple as that.

Well then when you make an MMO you can do item progression that way. The developers of the one we’re all playing don’t like that design philosophy anymore and have (years ago) changed the status quo. And as far as we know they’ve used that rationale (the ilvl wall being bad) to explain design decisions as recent as April so, uh, sorry pal you’re out of luck if you want something different.

And that wall exists, it’s just not where you want it to be.

True. It’s an ~15-20 ilvl gap from top to bottom now which is perfectly fine at the end of a tier.

[Burkkins-moon-guard]

maybe Burkkins is a little slow

TFW u claim not to care about gear, but go around insulting people.

[Terranox-stonemaul (Terranox)]

They are basically doing the same thing in wotlk with the wotlk patches. Idk whats the problem. It worked back then and got players raiding even alts into pugs.

[Burkkins-moon-guard]

True. It’s an ~15-20 ilvl gap from top to bottom now which is perfectly fine at the end of a tier.

15-20 ilvl gap from mythic raiders, but heroic and normal raiders are on same spot as people who do literally nothing. I guess only mythic raiders matter in this game.

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

But raids remained, and now they killed that too by removing tier sets and throwing free gear at players.

Raids have changed in their design theory as well, but I do agree that removing Tier set gear was a bad idea. However, having multiple gearing paths is bad.

[Kydrav-bleeding-hollow]

Gear is being rewarded based on difficulty. You’re just posting because the gap isn’t as wide as you want it to be. And overall average item level is what really matters, not just a person getting lucky with one or two slots.

The problem with that is, luck shouldn’t be a factor it should be about difficulty. I wouldn’t have a problem with people who want to do solo content if it had mage tower like features where it was actually challenging, not just time gated WQs as I stated earlier. You’re correct, I don’t believe WQs should be rewarding heroic raids/m10+/rival range gear because the difficulty level between those isn’t even remotely close to repeated completions of WQs.

And that wall exists, it’s just not where you want it to be.

Correct don’t have a problem with WQs giving gear, just not equal to content that is much more difficult.

As Burkkins just said:

15-20 ilvl gap from mythic raiders, but heroic and normal raiders are on same spot as people who do literally nothing. I guess only mythic raiders matter in this game.

Doing this just degrades LFR/Normal/Heroic/M10+/Rival Rankings.

[Mysfyre-norgannon (Mysfyre)]

Didn’t read all the replies, but I’ll put in my $0.02 anyways.

I didn’t raid for the loot. I raided for the memories and the people I raided with. The gear was a possible bonus for if we did well. I’ve gone TIERS without a drop. It was crafting, badges, and rep that filled my slots. Crafting, badges, and rep no longer have endgame gear. WQs are the new backup plan.

Having access to higher level gear, I can grind out little by little, may allow me to get back into raiding so I can make more of those memories.

Higher tier raiders get drops at or above the level I can work to. You kill a boss and can get an item at X level with possible titanforging on top of it. I grind for 2 weeks and get one item at X level. Raider gets Y chances at gear “pre-upgraded” plus the WQ grind is available. Non-raider gets the grind for one. WQs have a limit you can do in a week as well.

More people with “acceptable” item levels slowly increasing should be a good thing for raid groups. From what I’ve seen, they won’t be 430 equipped in a day or week, but can slowly work up that slot RNG has forsaken…

I can see them doing a mobile pet game… hell as someone in marketing I’d consider them stupid not too, especially when it doesn’t really effect the game.

Still waiting on that! Such a missed opportunity.

[Avagon-sisters-of-elune]

TFW u claim not to care about gear, but go around insulting people.

To repeat, I did not claim the former. That’s the lie you keep saying as if it means something. I’m not sure why. But those things aren’t mutually exclusive even if it was true (again, it’s not). It’s entirely possible to be snarky and not care about gear. That’s not my position. I do care, it’s just not the most important thing to me, and I can be snarky. It’s kinda like it’s possible for you to be both salty and snarky. They’re also not mutually exclusive.

[Searik-skullcrusher (Searik)]

I wouldn’t chalk up all leaves to lulls, overall BfA has been rather unsatisfying despite the raids being good… but just having good raids isnt enough to keep people around. Hell even WoD proved that, BRF is one of my top 3 raids yet even I wouldn’t try to defend the expansion beyond things like gear and classes not being as bad as it got.

And wpvp is suppose to be unbalanced imo… I think the bigger issue with that was allowing faction changes but thats probably an unpopular opinion.

[Burkkins-moon-guard]

And as I said before, you not caring about gearing much, calling it secondary thing, doesn’t mean everyone shares your opinion. People like gear, it’s in every game, you progress through game and obtain the gear equal to content you reach, that’s the curve, the progression. Now mythic raiders get their progression, while all others get merged together, doesn’t matter what you do, you all end up on same spot, except the shiny mythic raiders.

[Mogar-stormrage (Mogar)]

Stop rewarding mindless/skilless play with good gear, it’s unnecessary. Reward players for completing difficult content.

People enjoy different things. If you think gear makes you good, or makes you feel superior to others, you’re going to have to choose a better argument to make.

Apparently everyone enjoys gear, though?