Its an issue when mages get melee killed in raids because of it. Just because you haven’t seen it doesn’t mean it never happens. I played since vanilla too… what does that have to do with anything?
This is the first I’ve ever heard about it since WoW released so playing since vanilla is relevant.
This is a contradiction. 1.12 is not early Vanilla its late/ near end of Vanilla. so its not nerfed in the way people are clamming nerfed. that is how it was, in that patch. Sure, there is a good chance there were some nerfs and buffs to thing between 1.0-1.12
side note, people claiming that private serves being harder is proof is not proof because they artificially buffed the mobs to be harder than Vanilla 1.12
In cases where tank is in danger, it is useful to frostnova so tank can step away. I’ve been saved a couple times in this way.
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My favorite are the mages that FN > CoC > AE and I’m like “Yeah… could you stop making me have to spam heal you? Thanks.”
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i only bring my own mages because, as a bear also, the frost nova is perfect for giving me kiting space to get out of fray and off heal and readjust position
but this has to be coordinated- as does pretty much any kind of playstyle
1 mage only (sean connery -ramius “one ping only”) who i am familiar with (run with before and friended) for cc, controlled novas and dps
mage and bear work well together if coordinated
but i also make sure i have a shammy, a priest (or another druid) and a rogue
Agree with the OP as someone who’s mained a tank and a healer.
A tank CAN often manage a pull when DPS go balls out early on a pull, FN, etc.
A healer CAN often keep a group up on a pull where DPS are pulling aggro.
However, it doesn’t mean they should. It’s not really faster, and its just being a jerk to your tank and healer who are having to triage during an entire dungeon while the DPS engage in the most braindead play they know. I don’t think it’s a question of what’s possible or slightly more min-maxed - it’s a matter of showing a little courtesy to the guy trying to manage threat.
You’re chilling out with a 3 or 4 button rotation while the tank is running all over trying to manage a chaotic pull and the healer is blowing mana they shouldn’t have to. There’s a reason it’s difficult to find a tank, and that reason is DPS who don’t make the slightest effort to manage threat.
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Hmm that might have been a typo. UBRS elites 2 shotted clothies.
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I don’t remember if this was a thing in vanilla. But didn’t you get more threat than usual for casting spells in melee range?
and that’s the crux of it, right there.
If you’re on comms with people you know, this kind of play is fun. It really is, and I get it. If you’re in a pug, however, and communication is limited to chat typing, there’s nothing fun about it for the tank and healer.
I loved pugging in Vanilla, and I still pug relatively frequently in retail (always have done), but the longer I play this game (in whatever iteration I’m playing), the less I like playing in pick ups. You never know what you’re going to get, but you can be pretty sure if there’s any aspect of it you don’t like, you’ll get booted for saying so or asking for something different to be done.
That isn’t fun…and neither is spending the entire dungeon working from oom, worried that someone is going to die and then boot you even though you haven’t been allowed to drop combat to drink in four pulls, the dps are all taking damage, and you–the healer–have been getting slammed by mobs since the first aggro pull was made.
It’s chaotic and stressful instead of ordered and enjoyable during runs like that. The next time you’re spamming for tanks and healers and they’re all saying, “sorry, I’m doing x, y, or z instead,” just know the real reason sometimes is: we don’t trust pugs to not be cruel to us, and ain’t nobody got time for that.
Edited to add: I don’t think I’ve ever been booted from a dungeon group. I think I’d remember that if I had. I’m just a nervous introvert with strangers, and so I tend to worry that I will be. If a run starts off frenetic and unpredictable…it amplifies this. Some days, I’m not down for that.
You must not be very good.
Only classic matters. Not everyone in classic played vanilla. Lots of noobs running around.
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This is usually me. I suck at paying attention to what’s going on around me. My attention is generally focused on whatever is right in front of me or whatever I’m currently fighting.
Your experience is of bad mages. One shouldn’t start a fight by trying to pull agro from the outset. Obviously the tank needs to be hit to gain rage. But frost nova does have a fantastic place in dungeons. When the healer gets agro, you peal, pull the mobs back to the tank, and FN them around the tank. So that he has plenty of time to pick up agro while they are hitting him. I think this is sort of like the “No fearing in instances” rule that existed in vanilla. Good warlocks use fear safely and well. Bad warlocks do not. it’s that simple. And this is why Classic is awesome. There is a difference between good and bad players, at every level, at every stage. Just my opinion.
Thanks for the bump
So basically, the game is easier than it should be because we have 1.12 values in phase 1, by definition meaning “nerfed”
But making the game “harder” and giving mobs correct phase damage/HP/armor values as they did on private servers is somehow “buffed”
Man that’s an intense mental workout
Generally AOE in dungeons and raids is a no-no, however it can be used strategically in some fights. Fear, psychic scream, FN, generally not helpful, often more harm than good.
Exactly, such as stacking mobs on Sulfuron and Domo.
But Frost Nova isn’t an aoe damage ability it’s a defensive control ability and outside of certain situations, mainly PVP, it shouldn’t be used offensively pretty much ever due to the mechanics of root abilities
Fear in a dungeon is for those people who are like, “You know how it is fighting Murlocks? I wish EVERY fight could be like that!”
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I agree with you.
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It’s nice that the trolls and flamers mainly went away it’s hard for them to stay focused on subjects that require critical thinking