It was good in some ways but terrible in others.
The good was seeing some of the clans in their pre-fel corrupted state. We can get a rough idea of what Orc society might have been like before they were corrupted and turned into monsters. The bad was… well, the attempt at genocide, only this time the manipulator behind the scenes was Garrosh, not Gul’dan and the Burning Legion.
Then as I said, there is no one in the Horde for the Night Elves to claim victory against if the Horde do leave Ashenvale.
Well, that’s what I was talking about. They are the consequence of Grond’s creation. People don’t know anything about orc lore. But I do headcanon.
Yes they are children of Aggramar, otherwise what are they?
They certainly are.
Aggramar isn’t a ‘god of war’ though. He is a Titan Champion, and has never been venerated as a god of war or conflict, because that’s not what he is about.
It’s true he experimented on elementals that, thousands of years later, would end up creating the Orcs, but to claim they’re children of a ‘god of war’ is just nonsense.
Because its bad story telling, Andiun’s story is not a replacement human lore.
Thats like replacing all orc lore with Thrall’s personal journey.
But you are justifying them going to Ashenvale, taking resources there and killing people for sport over there because Orcs go BRRRRRRRRRRR right?
Warcraft 3 was 2 decades ago, we have a new reality facing us, WC3 in no way justifies what is happening now in the story or how characters or players want the Horde behave or be responded to going forward. Its not because the Orcs look different but because they have done bad things.
Ok sure but thats their personal journey, it doesn’t mean other races have to accept that or condone that. The Orcs want to attack to kill or be killed by NEs? Sure ok but the NE’s didn’t give consent to participate in this bloody ritual. They are just defending themselves and that doesn’t make them fascist.
No they are not a “warrior” race as you call them, they are warriors and have warriors but they are so much more. Just because they have Martial prowess doesn’t mean thats all they are or that is their sole motivator.
If being a fighting was all a race was I can show you how that looks like.
Sometimes you don’t have to burn a capital to kill the lore for a race. Orcs are a great example of this. Wc3 or vanilla wow’s orcs were shamanistic who victims of the legion. They were a shamanistic people look for a home. They had a lot of trait that would of made them natural Allie’s of the night elf. Such as not lieing not taking more then what is needed. Versus the humans who used natural resources for profit or luxury.
What happened to this orcish race. Well it has been destroyed by constant villain batting. Garrosh’s war started off as a struggle for survival as orcs were starving, and who started the war was unclear. Well until blizzard retconed and made it all about Garrosh going rouge. You know the rest, than to make it even better. Hear me out we went back in time to fight the iron horde. This was the worse thing to happen to them. We were told orcs were shamanistic until they got tricked to go to war but here on WOD they just do it just because. Then we get BFA where horde again goes to war for no reason…. Like sylvanas was attacked her fleet sunk but that didn’t start the war but now horde goes to war and
You know the rest, as a orc fan I don’t know what orcs are. So far by their own natural they are pure evil, again and again they do the unthinkable. Where is the honor? What honorable things have the orcs even done? When has honor even been shown as something important to them.
Aggramar was considered a Lieutenant by the Titans, and mostly tasked with combat against the demons of the Twisting Nether.
Sure, but that doesn’t make him a ‘god of war’.
He’s never been venerated as such, ever, by anyone.
Dwarves literally call the Titans their gods. So do the Mogu.
I used the term god of war because that’s the best way to define what titans are in Warcraft. Now we know that there are actually beings superior to them, such as the first ones. But the titans were for all intents and purposes the gods of Warcraft for a long time. And furthermore, it’s clearly in my post that I’m making an allusion without any strict attachment to lore, and yes Aggramar was a titan who was simply assigned to go to war in the name of the titan project. I think it’s at least funny that Aman’thul can be called the lord of time, and that Eonar can be called the life binder, but that Aggramar can’t be associated with a god of war.
Every Titan can be associated with a class, Aggramar identifies best with warrior
Because that’s not his title.
Each of the Titans has a title they are:
Aman’thul - Highfather of the Pantheon
Eonar - The Lifebinder
Norgannon - Keeper of Celestial Magics and Lore
Golganneth - Lord of the Skies and Raging Oceans
Khaz’goroth - Shaper and Forger of Worlds
Sargeras - Defender of Worlds (until his corruption)
Argus - The Unmaker
Aggramar - Lieutenant of the Great Sargeras
It is more than likely (although not confirmed) that after Sargeras’s corruption when he became known as the ‘Destroyer of Worlds’ that Aggramar would have taken over his role and title, becoming the Defender of Worlds.
Does the new orc heritage quest help at all? It seems a lot of people liked it.
For the same way you describe the Orcs beig mangled by the new narrative, the same is true for me for the Night Elves and their constant inability to be what they were supposed to be.
Their constant whimpering, crying and inability to even defend themselves. Its just not what I was expecting. Some Horde players think Night Elf fans just want to punt the Horde across the world to assert their superiority complex. That couldn’t be further from the truth.
I just want the NEs to have their home and be able to defend it. But the Horde and this writing has absolutely destroyed that. The Night Elves are sad pushovers that get absolutely steamrolled and kicked around every couple of years. The latest lore where they literally have to leave their home land to be safe from the Horde is what I have left to look forward to.
But I know its the best I can get at this point.
And I have to deal with some posters like Akhinoz that argues somehow the Night Elves are fault for living their life and not being subservient enough for the PoC coded Orcs. Its just insane to me.
I really hope for you the Orc racial fantasy bounces back. I would also like the Orcs and NEs to get a long because they can have a lot of things in common but they would have to go through an apology tour that you would probably hate for me to ever be alright with any such development.
So much drama, just because I used the term “sport” now you feel deeply violated and think this will change the fact that actions that occurred in Warcraft 3 involving orcs and kaldorei were justified from the orcs’ point of view.
Again, I never agreed with Horde’s actions in Cata, MP, and BFA. And I have already said numerous times that they were typical of imperialist regimes with fascist traits. You want to invent a disagreement that doesn’t exist.
Apparently Aggramar’s title is now <The Avenger>.
No I am arguing against your take here because this sport makes Orcs into monsters and their coexistence with anyone that doesn’t become subservient to them impossible because either they are future victims or enemies or both
And you trying to blame the NEs or any other Alliance race for defending themselves against this aggression as fascist is screwed up.
Then I stand corrected on his current title. Thank you.
Bro, kaldorei are literally inspired by amazons, do you really know what you’re talking about? You have to distort reality so much to not accept obvious things that it becomes kind of impossible to have a debate with you.
Every human in Stormwind at the age of 12 already had a full battle set, they had something basically identical to Spartan agoge, but weren’t they a warrior race? My god you really need to better understand the inspirations of the game you’ve been playing.
Yes they were inspired by Amazons but they are not a warrior race with a warrior culture.
I don’t think you understand what you are saying. The NEs have many other inspirations and references as well, the Amazon inspiration doesn’t have monopoly.
Just because a people have warriors doesn’t mean their entire culture is solely based on being warriors.
I am going to need a source on this and no.
The Stormwind humans do not have helot slaves so the entire population could dedicate itself to being the perfect warrior.