No big deal, the night elves have three or four reasons to be paranoid, the Horde … one?
I’m going to have to ask for more specificity on this one - I didn’t buy Chronicles, nor will I.
Did it retcon Cataclysm in this manner? Did it establish that Garrosh’s invasion didn’t take place at the same time as the attack on Hyjal, as the Cataclysm manual establishes? Further, are you understanding what I mean by “official capacity” here?
It establishes that the invasion of the Firelands was a joint effort between the Alliance and Horde, with the Cenarion Circle coordinating that effort. I’d also encourage you to look at the Protectors of Hyjal quest on Wowhead or Wowpedia. If High Warlord Cromush is considered a protector of Hyjal, the Horde’s official presence there is self-evident.
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Fair enough - this however still doesn’t resolve the matter of the Horde simultaneously pulling resources from the preceding Twilight invasion and this with their attack on Ashenvale. It remains an open question if the Horde’s contribution is a net positive due to this.
Which is the point and the problem.
Hmm. The Horde chopped down the night elf forest three times after / during the apocalypse.
What are the sins of the Alliance in “peacetime”? Dwarf archaeologists, goblin miners, Genn in Storheim … everyone?
Are you doing okay?
Which kind of goes back IMO to the question of the game identity. Is it about factions, or not?
If it’s about cosmic threats, why keep game-play restrictions for the players?
If it’s about factions, where is the story about divided factions being the core / better than alternative in a given fictional setting?
We have a fair share of PvP activities while dealing with the TBC story centered around Kil’Jaeden and his machinations (Illidan - KJ interactions since W3).
The fight against C’Thun has plenty of quests about factions raiding each other right in Silithus.
ICC raid has a gunship encouter between the factions. Right during the siege of the citadel of evil at the time.
In canon faction bashing each other is a proven and good-enough method of fighting against world ending threats. Choice of “together” or like in pre-Cata time is purely on the dev preferences.
And how is it presented?
Terenas Menethil II: Without its master’s command, the restless Scourge will become an even greater threat to this world.
Terenas Menethil II: Control must be maintained… There must always be… a Lich King…
Scourge currently running in Redridge might maybe not indicate that the scourge could be a problem when not constrained.
gl hf
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I agree. I’m of the opinion that the Fourth War should be the last official major conflict between the Alliance and Horde, for at least a few expansions. Continue the cold war, if you want, but as far as mechanics go, have PvP be based around expansion specific factions like the Aldor/Scryers or the current Covenants.
Then allow for cross-faction PvE; or drop the faction restriction for races in general. Void elves/blood elves and pandaren already muddle the distinction aesthetically. Humans have been canonically established as working for the Horde as spies and mercenaries. Night elves have been risen into the ranks of the forsaken. Plenty of goblin cartels work with both factions and should logically be able to be found in both. Grimtotem tauren have allied with the Alliance in the past as well.
Allowing players to make the choice whether to be loyal to their home faction or defect (or roleplay it as neutrality) would provide so much narrative potential for individual players to express themselves, while simultaneously relieving some of the tension caused by racials effecting PvE content like Mythic+ and raiding.
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We can see how in the Shadowlands the devs use the narrative potential. So far - to replace a bunch of old lore with new concepts that barely fit or contradict it.
Fair enough, it’s one of options. Perhaps the only one the current dev team is capable to pull off.
There are other possibilities on paper, but, just like big moments, like waking of Azerorh, I would prefer the current team not try to exercise.
gl hf
Nah you’re just salty I pointed out that your leader is a hypocrite
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Why are you like this? Why do you choose to be this person? Being a contrarian is not an attractive personality trait, nor is it something to hinge your personality on.
Why do you insist on being mediocre as a human?
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its literally the lore the lich king was holding back, thats a fact
Just because he was testing who was the strongest amidst the people who opposed him doesn’t mean he was holding back. People died - a LOT of people.
I know you have this incessant drive to disagree with whatever people are saying - I’m sure if someone had said what you were arguing, you’d be gung-ho about saying Arthas was the biggest threat to Azeroth - and I know you’re physically incapable of admitting you’re wrong, but just know you’re wrong. Not just about this, but basically everything.
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he didnt invade everywhere like the legion did, he attacked stormwind and org once, and then the rest of the story was the alliance and horde attacking northrend together, yes it was a hard war, but it never seemed to be the global war like the legion war or the garrosh stuff, I mean westfall bridge was there, not defending home because the fighting was all in northrend I mean yeah if arthas won, it would have turned into a end times thing, but honestly it didnt
Not attacking everywhere and being a threat to the entire world are not mutually exclusive things.
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yes we know that but its obivious that the factions didnt, not at much, with the horde attacking the alliance, and the alliance taking time to attack undercity, it wasnt like as serious as legion was
So? Just because it wasn’t on the scale as the Legion doesn’t mean it wasn’t a world-ending threat.
Are you just arguing for the sake of arguing again?
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I think you are, kyalin was saying that the fact that the horde attacked the alliance during the war against the lich king means that the horde should never be trusted ever and they will back stab the alliance, so the alliance should make sure the horde doesnt exist
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I don’t agree with Kyalin’s sentiment, but that doesn’t change the scope of the Lich King’s threat.
Why are you using another person’s completely non-applicable argument to try and dispute mine? Just… you baffle me entirely. You are fully and completely baffling to talk to, it feels like an insult to my intelligence to even have to explain these basic things to you.
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you kind of just jumpped into the argument
I mean I know the lich king was a real threat, but i think its clear that both leaders in the horde and alliance didnt take him as seriously as they should have at least throught points in the xpac