We had a better classic. Private servers used the original game client. It worked just fine on modern computers. The private server devs actually did fix a lot of things that were obvious bugs and people weren’t crying about it, they appreciated it. Private servers were more stable, had less bugs and had less downtime than classic, and all the original add-ons from back in the day just worked. Period. The best thing about the original client is that spell batching didn’t exist and so abilities, spells and pet commands were instant. Bliz should have started with the original client and improved on it, rather than start with a future expansion and try to back peddle, but I think they lost the source code and had no choice. The more popular private servers shut down because of the hype about classic. They said they would be back if it wasn’t authentic. I’m counting the days. #privateserverlivesmatter
Even the private servers use spell batching, it’s just a much tighter window and it’s also not artificial.
The Modern WoW engine has a very tight batch cycle, heck it’s got multiple channels of spell batching all on very tight cycles…
modern wow’s engine is not with out some wonky BS tho, in the short time that I played it I noticed some things that felt really bad (server lag).
I HONESTLY don’t know what is the real deal with Classic, but I can tell ya what… It sure as heck does run worse than actual vanilla did back in 2004 if you ignore the server crashes, my server was down weekly…
I played for a single day on a private server (RL buddies account and characters) and I gotta tell ya it felt 100% Vanilla AS I REMEMBER IT…
There is one thing in life you cannot fool, and that’s muscle memory… You just kinda naturally do things in a certain way after you have trained your self…
I remember when TBC shipped I did a /played and I had a staggering 167 Days played… I was a WoW addict back then and that’s how I just know how busted hunters are… When I got on that private server I knew straight away that it was playing correctly (PVP)
It’s just one of those things you cannot fake, it’s either working properly or it’s not. The private servers do the PVP thing properly.
I don’t know what makes you think this. I tried leveling a hunter on retail and spell batching has completely broken beast master hunters. It takes 1-2 seconds for your pet to respond to any command… Literally… and even the hunter guides say it’s broken to the point where you have to create macros for every ability or your pet won’t attack things properly. I imagine spell batching in general is less noticeable in retail though since the game has been dumbed down for tablets.
Every online game game or game that has a server separate from the client has a form of batching.
What it is is simply a way for your client (the game you see) to talk back and forth with the server (the actual game itself)
The goal is to do this as effectively as possible. In vanilla this complete cycle time was 400ms.
In classic 2019, they say it’s 400, but in practice it feels like 1200 for certain things.
Vanilla also worked different, as a result even if they simply copy pasted the raw values from Vanilla to classic, it’s not likely to function as it did in actual Vanilla the system is very different.
They simply need to tighten the batch cycle to play like vanilla did.
Heck, at this point I would take an improvement over that simply to eliminate a plethora of problems.
There is another possible problem, and that is server lag in certain poorly coded spells and abilities.
That’s could be attributed to the translation of Vanilla spell tables into the modern WoW format.
That and it’s very unlikely they brought over any vanilla era big fixes to broken logic in the game architecture (regardless of the engine)
I hate spell batching probably as much or more than anyone in this thread.
[00:01:00.745] Delimicus casts Lay on Hands on Mulligan
[00:01:01.488] Mulligan dies from Firesworn 4’s Melee
This caused a chain reaction that led to us wiping because our Resto Druid (lol) Bear tank was tanking all the Garr adds. We lost all our world buffs and my parse ended up being 96% instead of 99%, QQ. Vanilla spell batching punishes quick reactions and good players.
However, I’ve seen absolutely no evidence that spell batching is not working correctly. To the contrary, I’ve seen plenty of video evidence and Blizzard’s own words showing that it’s working correctly.
If you feel the need to atone for advocating spell batching, don’t do so by claiming that it’s not working properly. Admit the Vanilla batching is stupid and apologize for EVER advocating such a system be used in Classic.
It’s called TCP/IP or UDP. These are the two protocols available to talk back and forth with a server over the internet. “Spell batching” is just another way of saying “queue events before processing them”. AKA delay them. In reality, they shouldn’t be queued or delayed. They should be processed immediately in the order they are received.
Well at least Classic WoW’s batching sure as heck does; it’s crap… The fact that I can no longer FD trap reliable and am forced into Scatter shot is really annoying.
That’s where I disagree, I don’t think it’s even possible for it to work properly in Classic because in Classic it’s all handled server side where as in Vanilla some stuff was processed client side; this is something we learned about in TBC when a certain warrior got busted for hacking the most subtle thing possible that made such a large difference… (arena tournament) he was hacking his auto attack swing timer… You would think that’s nothing but with normalized 2.0 rage generation, that’s massive!
After that call to reality Blizzard changed how the client worked (a patch or 2 later) and moved everything server side.
Also consider that even though the batch cycle on the private servers is indeed faster the game plays virtually the same as we all remember vanilla (PVP) I could care less about PVE play, PVE is only there for gear to go PVP with.
Absolutely THIS. The backport was the first mistake. Everything else followed. Frankly, they should release a so-called “Reference Client” server and have done with it. Players would flock to it in droves.
No they wouldn’t because it would play exactly like Classic does now. You do realize they use their reference client to determine all these things you people are complaining about are in fact authentic and functioning correctly, right?
LOL no.
Removing flight, withholding flight and now placing obstacles in the air just to disrupt air travel, from/in areas that are flight enabled will be the last straw. You heard it here.
Vanilla never had flight so no one ever had any expectation of flying in Old Azeroth.
Retail servers are already empty and the player base cannot survive another hit like the one it took in 2015 (from which it’s never recovered).
This will not end well.
Use of the reference server does not mean they shipped us a bug free true 100% Vanilla experience.
If that were true then they would not have bug fixed countless things already.
Correct, there are bugs that have been fixed and more that will be fixed. The things you and others have been relentlessly complaining about have already been confirmed to be working properly.
Leeway, for example. I’ve already shown you plenty of videos that prove it’s working properly along with Blizzard’s own tests and confirmation that it’s working properly, yet you still claim it’s not.
If they released their reference client, spell batching and leeway would be the same. The things people hate more than anything would be the same because Vanilla wasn’t perfect and had some really stupid systems that we could have avoided being implemented if you people didn’t scream “No-changes” and praise Blizzard for recreating garbage mechanics.
471 upvotes on that spell batching thread. You don’t see my upvote there, because I’ve been against the Vanilla spell batching ever since I remembered how awful it was.
Whoa there dude, not everyone was screaming no changes… I was very strongly against a raw state of 1.12 with out raid tuning but like you I was also shouted down because the kids want their 1.12…
I would rather have rather they re-tuned all the content to be as close to the original difficulty level as possible (still would be easy) but it would be a different experience for sure… More so the dungeons, but even the raids and to some degree the BiS lists would be different. (not entirely but different none the less).
It’s my opinion that Artificial batching is dumb… IF they could replicate the exact experience of how things played out in vanilla; sure I guess even tho some of it is kinda broken then I would be on board, but till they can get the most simple 100% VANILLA things right… FD + Trap, I am fully against artificial batching.
You have provided “vanilla” vidoes showing cases of leeway working as it kinda does in Classic, but I also pointed out that not every single player had that kind of reach in Vanilla, it was actually very rare to encounter that.
The problem is this, do we go with a literal and frankly stupid interpretation of the game, or do we go with what the overall experience of the game was in that era?
If a literal interpretation is what matters most then Classic 2019 I guess kinda does that, but if the “Vanilla experience” is what matters then Leeway then needs to just be deleted because it’s a system designed to not be detected by the players.
Artificial batching… presently dude it plays like crap, and this is what we get to look forward too in both TBC and Wrath when they come out because the system did not get an overhaul till Cata…
Do we really want that? I don’t, do you?
You keep saying this, it’s dishonest. What we have is the Vanilla batching, Blizzard has confirmed it. You “arguing” against it by calling it artificial batching isn’t going to convince them to change it.
You’re patronizing Blizzard, that’s not going to work.
This is the kind of post that caused us to end up in this situation. Blizzard took this to heart and we are here now. Look how many likes those kinds of posts got.
People didn’t want a better experience, they wanted an authentic one. I wanted a better experience, I wanted 99% no-changes with a side of common sense. I lost.
They’re artificially interpreting the batch cycles you can see it in how Flare reacts with stealth targets like druids and rogues.
If they batching was truly 400ms, then they could in theory get into range and pounce / cheap shot before flare broke them out.
Right now, my flair plays like it’s reacting to stealth targets instantly while damage and CC abilities feel like they’re on a batch delay.
If all things were equal and blizzard was truly using a 400ms batch then why does Execute have roughly double this delay when in vanilla it’s been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that it was indeed a 400ms at most delay?
It’s reasonable to assume then that they’re not truly doing things 100% correctly as it has been demonstrated that their existing system is indeed broken.
blizzards blue post says
They said they move spell casting to the slower frequency, but I suspect they did not “Batch” the entire game.
Perhaps they’re doing all the “Batching” on the backend and processing things in chunks while not disturbing the existing system.
Without getting under the hood to see what is really going on there is no way to know how they’re handling things…
One thing is 100% certain, not all game features run like they did in Vanilla, there are many inconsistencies.
I am still wanting 99% no changes with some common sense details… /cough leeway deleted would be a good start.
This statement proves you are lying, because if you wanted 99% no chances with a side of common sense, you wanted what private servers gave us for years up to the very day classic came out. Private servers used the original game client, had all the original bugs, all the original add-ons and the old macro system and most importantly did not have the delays in casting abilities and spells and commanding pets. Spells, abilities and pet commands were instant using the original reference client. Tens of thousands of users were playing true and authentic vanilla on private servers for years. We know that “Classic”, using the Legion client, has a delay in almost everything that happens in the game, causing almost every class in the game to be broken in some way. EVERY CLASS. And no, it hasn’t been fixed, despite whatever blue posts you’ve seen. I don’t really care what you call it, whether it be spell batching, leeway, or your moms paduka. DELAYED gaming is NOT how VANILLA was.
I laugh at the people who think that because blizzard says they checked the reference client that means everything is working perfectly like vanilla.
my 300 days played of muscle memory disagree.
Correct, and the private servers ARE 99% no-changes… They use a different higher frequency batching cycle and don’t include LEEWAY.
AKA exactly what I wanted except from Blizzard… That’s all I wanted, but instead they gave us this Modern WoW engine that runs like a turd.
BINGO! It’s easy to remember details wrong, but get on and play and you will simply know if something is working correctly or not.
I wonder if you guys even realize when they say “reference client”, they aren’t even referring to the original game client. They are referring to the back-peddled Legion client they are currently working on. This is their “reference” client. They are not using the original game client because they have no “reference server” to even play that game client with…
They basically created false hype to get rid of the private server scene and it worked. It doesn’t matter to them if classic flops. They wanted it to flop.
I’m not going to bother with your anti-Classic rhetoric any longer.