Sorry, unholy death knights are not necromancers get over it

Community General Discussion
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This is ALL that I was after, thank you for finally admitting it. It took you long enough, you tried EVERY avenue to justify this. You can claim it’s not a big deal, but I gave you a template as an early out! Had you just said “Yeah, I made a mistake, whoops!” I would not have hounded you over this. I only kept pointing it out because you were trying to dig your heels in!

Just for clarification, it was my post which brought up Immo Aura, you tried to refute it.

The fact that it is non existent in modern WoW was precisely my point. This is the reason I rattled off the WCIII DH Ability List. Every single ability they had was translated into the game & given to other classes. That didn’t stop them from adding Demon Hunters. This is the drum I have been beating from the start!

I did, but not at the start. I literally gave you an out, you chose to swat that away and say “Yes, I have played Warlock and I have played since the beginning, but I prefer Aff!”

You really don’t seem to understand that 99% of the grief I’ve given you over this could have been avoided had you just said “Whoops, didn’t know, my bad!” It is only when you double down, or try to salvage the point that I attack.

(And guess what, I hate tanking. I still have some degree of familiarity with how Prot War & Blood DK have changed over the years. I’m not going to hop in a debate and make authoritative declarations about them, but I’m not a complete stranger to changes despite having never played either in a tanking capacity!)

You were being extremely pedantic, you’re welcome for returning the favor :slight_smile:

I have quite a bit left, I just had to zero in on this because you, for some reason, decided to completely ignore the substantive points I was making in favor of Necromancer.

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A hypothetical Necromancer in WoW could heavily utilize things like the Apothecary theme in the form of Cauldrons, Spores, Loatheb Monsters, caustic mixtures, etc. We see these things feature very heavily in the Forsaken, Scourge & Maldraxxi.

Death Knights, because they are so heavily tied to the “Dark Knight” theme cannot effectively utilize these things, and can never fill any “Apothecary” niche.

Narrow thinking, lack of imagination/10.

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Dks are necromancers.

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That’s the problem, you rather focus on a trivial point that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter because wait for it… It no longer exists… It hasn’t existed for nearly a decade.

You rather go down a rabbit hole over something that any new player for the last decade wouldn’t even be privy to something even existing let alone using the appropriate name for it.

This is what I mean when I kept saying you can’t see the forest through the trees :evergreen_tree: as I already pointed out numerous times. Meaning you just wanted to argue over a pointless endeavor as it has no purpose to the larger conversation at hand… The forest which in the case was the origin of class spells going back to Warcraft RTS days.

Sure after you shared a list of WC3 Demon Hunter abilities, I claimed warlocks never had Immolation Aura. Then you attempted and failed at providing a link to a spell that has been gone for nearly a decade and in its last form it was a passive anyway and Immolation Aura from WC3 was not a passive, it was a toggle.

The point was that they don’t have them. Regardless of the fact that they may have had them in the past, they no longer do. The fact that I said they never had Immolation Aura shouldn’t even matter to the conversation, but instead you went full tilt because you think an ability lost for 10 years needs to be discussed for reasons.

This furthers my point as that implies currently. Else I would have stated Warlocks have always had Immolate if my intent is to address it’s entire history. I was trying to address what the warlock has in its begining and what the Demon Hunter has in its begining respectively warlock in Vanilla and Demon Hunter in WC3.

If it was, you wouldn’t have derailed the conversation and waste both our and others times because you wanted a direct acknowledgement over a trivial matter that doesn’t matter and hasn’t mattered for 10 years because it no longer exists which is what I stated and tried to keep on topic yet here you are doing you best efforts to discuss inconsequential things.

I’m not and I won’t play your game, I discuss the topic at hand, not get lost in the nuisances of meaningless inconsequential things. You are just a irritating and insufferable individual.

I don’t care what you think you are entitled to, you actively chose to detail the topic because someone doesn’t speak the way you want them too. You can go all the way off the face of the earth on that note, you are an awful person.

No one cares.

No, you are just actively responding in an insincere manner to purposely detail the conversation at hand. You are a horrible person.

No, you wasted time in derailing topics because you had an ego and your a brat.

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286

What part of my argument are you misunderstanding here? What point do you believe I’m making?

It doesn’t matter how long Immolation Aura has been gone for, the point was that it was part of the WCIII DH toolkit & was given to Warlocks (Who, again, had it for nearly a decade, since you want to pretend this is a VERY long amount of time). The fact that Warlocks had this did not prevent Blizzard from adding Demon Hunters.

This has pretty straightforward implications for any discussion on Necromancers, especially when you were citing WCIII abilities being rolled into the DK Class in WoW.

This was literally at the heart of my entire point, but you were way too invested in trying to salvage your mistake to address that. In fact, you still haven’t addressed it.

You are so mad lmao. I’m not the one who made a mistake here, that’s you, no need to take it out on me! I didn’t “fail” at providing a link, it was there, you had to replace “(DOT)” with “.”

Warlocks had it for “nearly a decade” I’m really not sure why you think this is remotely relevant to the point I was making. The fact that you continue posting this phrase suggests you fundamentally do not understand the argument I was making.

It passively modified Hellfire to be Immo Aura, before that it functioned more or less like WCIII’s Immo Aura barring some tweaks for different game formats.

But again, none of this is relevant to the point I was making, which you seem to genuinely NOT understand at all. Either you don’t get the point, or you’re so mad & trying to correct the record so hard that you’re missing the actual substance of what I was raising there. Both are funny, but I think the latter is a little more ironic given the accusations you’ve been throwing at me.

You are so close to understanding the point I was making. SO close.

Yes, it does actually. It is highly relevant to the question of design space for new classes and what constitutes permanent occupation of said design space. It has significant implications for how far Blizzard is willing to go in order to add new Classes.

Are you seriously still trying to salvage this? This is the reason I keep making fun of you. You’re unable to just say “whoops, my bad!” and move on to the actual substance. You claim it’s irrelevant and I shouldn’t hold it against you, but you keep trying to nitpick my criticisms of this & defend the initial mistake you made.

No, you’re not discussing the actual topic at hand. If you were, we wouldn’t be having this conversation right now. You would have actually addressed the substantive claim I made instead of trying to defend a mistake you made. You did this, not me.

You are mad on the internet because someone called out the fact that you got something wrong. You are obviously SEETHING right now & it’s apparent in basically every single post you’ve made since I issued the correction. I mean the earlier attempts to “own” me in order to even the scoreboard were desperate and deeply pathetic.

Lol mad.

Lol mad.

Lol mad.

Lol mad.

Now, in your next response, here’s something you should try:

1.) Rephrase the argument you BELIEVE I was making by citing the WCIII DH toolkit
2.) Actually address and respond to that argument.

I will either issue a correction to clarify my ACTUAL intended point if you get it wrong. If you get it right, I will respond to your criticism of my argument.

THAT is how you have the productive conversation you apparently want to have (The one I was trying to have in the first place!). Believe me, that will go much further than yet another post where you’re red in the face and whining about how “I’m being REALLY mean :((((((”

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Actually yeah they did. It was supposed to be added to the game along with the DK back in Vanilla, but they cut them from the game, the DK was added with the 2nd expansion.

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So, not actually added at all, and never existed in WoW.

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I’m not overcomplicating anything. You people are by saying it can’t be done when it was already done. The DK and the Necromancer existed in Warcraft III and WoW as separate units. In fact they were gonna be playable classes in Vanilla.
I mean who the hell do you think you are to decide what is doable and what isn’t when you aren’t even involved in any way in this creation process?
So yeah, spare me the BS about how it can’t be done and just say you don’t want it done for whatever reason. I wouldn’t mind that at all.

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Agreed.

I will never understand how certain posters outright ignore game mechanics and gameplay and push what amounts to nothing more than headcanon.

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Uh, they gave the Necromancer unit’s abilities to the DK class. Developers even said they took the concept of the Necromancer and placed it in the DK class.

When we have Blizzard outright saying that DK is essentially a Necromancer, why are you still living in denial?

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292

This community LOVES making up arbitrary sets of rules, ignoring when their arbitrary rules are broken, and then loudly declaring that the class they DON’T LIKE should never be added, while the class they DO LIKE should.

That’s all this boils down to. It’s very cheap.

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I agree, I don’t see Unholy DKs as romancing necks kind of class. They’re more like a leg romancing class.

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Two classes should not be doing the same thing is an arbitrary rule?

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The way you define it, little baby Teriz? Absolutely. But you already knew that.

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I’m not the one living in denial here. You are the one making up a fantasy world and acting like you got a say in what’s gonna happen or not, as if Blizzard’s imagination and ability to create a class is solely based on your opinion and that is crap simply because Blizzard has done it before. They did it with Warlocks and Demon Hunters. There were guys like you saying the exact same crap about Demon Hunters back before Legion. That the Demonology Warlock is too similar to the Demon Hunter and therefore a Demon Hunter class is no longer possible. But it was. So yeah, you talk crap man.

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A class summoning swarms of undead, spreading disease and corruption, using death magic and conjuring up bone weaponry is only how I define a Necromancer?

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Except Blizzard never stated that Warlocks are demon hunters. They have stated that they used Necromancers to create Death Knights.

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YES!! That would be awesome!! I already have like two undead characters mogged to resemble them; Horde has been dumped on so much with losing characters would be nice if they brought back Teron Gorefiend and they could easily shoehorn fel orcs/red customization and Gen 1 Death knights somehow. Dude literally said, “the wheel spins again…” can’t be that hard to write him back!

Oh, and speaking specifically of WC2 Death knights… that growl noise they sometimes make cracks me up for some reason. “Mrrrrarrr!!!”

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Necromancers are hostile mobs.
Except they’re forsaken.

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You mean a Lich?

Liches dont even need to wear cloth armor, they just have to make sure their phylactery is protected.

Death Knights are necromancers since they use necromancy.

Huh? Arthas Killed Kel’thuzad. Arthas then sought out Frostmourne and he was already a Death Knight when he sacked Lordaeron. KT showed up to Arthas and only Arthas could see him to not trust the Dreadlords. Arthas took his remains to the Sunwell to resurrect him as a Lich along with the help of Tichondrius.

I also dont know what KT could have taught Arthas since he was basically the main hand of the Lich King once he took up Frostmourne. So really the timeline is off, big time, with what you are trying to say. Did KT teach Arthas as a Lich when he was already a Death Knight, or when KT was just the leader of the Cult of the Damned when Arthas was full blown paladin mode at that point and totally against the scourge and undead?

Necromancers overall are just those that use necromancy (death magic). Death Knights are necromancers.

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