It already exists and has loyal players.
Your mythical itteration of surv that you’d love and enjoy does not exist, and might not be well received because you clearly care more about gut feelings and impressions than actually building up your own experience on the spec.
That alone is reason enough for surv to stay as it is. Some of us don’t want our spec changed every expansion because a vocal minority of people that play far less often than we do want to feel impactful by demanding changes.
You were the one making the assertion
We’re both making a lot of assertions, the only difference is I’m self-aware.
I never “abandoned” it, as evidenced by the fact that I’ve continued to raid on my hunter, though quite a bit less seriously. I also stopped raiding on my hunter specifically because of how significant the changes were to it in 7.0. This isn’t a “before”, this is a “because of”.
You know that the MSV of BFA is a completely different spec from the MSV of 7.0, right?
Are you sure you play your hunter?
I’m pretty sure you abandoned it to play other classes, my guy. How could you seriously be unaware that Legion surv and BFA/Shadowlands surv aren’t the same spec?
I’m pretty positive Xaedys plays hunter, given that he’s been on the hunter forums for a few years, and often shows knowledge of the class. Why do you need to know someone’s toon to contest the content of their argument? He’s not claiming to be the best pvper / raider or some other absurd personal claim.
Hey, guess what, that’s the same reason we are angry RSV got removed. Literally the exact reason.
The difference is you refuse to acknowledge the burden of evidence.
I’m well aware, and I tried both, and disliked both. I dislike BfA’s iteration slightly less, but only slightly, and I dislike it far more with BfA’s rotation-saturating iteration of Mongoose Bite.
You inferred that I am unaware of that. I never stated it or even implied it.
Look at my post history on this toon and tell me that I’ve abandoned the class.
Frankly, this is just more of your ad hominems. You know you can’t support your point, so you’re lashing out and trying to make me angry so I forget or don’t notice that.
I’m pretty sure someone with half the played time of a toon I made in Legion doesn’t actually play a hunter all that often, but simply spends a lot of time on the forums.
I don’t care how much forum clout he has, echo chambers aren’t that interesting.
The fact that you spend hours afk in town pumping your time played metrics so you can try to pull them out as “evidence” of your authority is meaningless.
Yeah, and you’re justified in that, but the answer is asking for RSV to be added as a fourth spec, not asking for our spec to be gutted so you can maybe enjoy the rework.
How about we compromise and send the BM hunters over as a ranged DH spec and replace them with RSV?
I’m from Emerald Dream, my server has a very active world pvp community, and each faction assaulting the others main city is quite common. I do spend a lot of time in Orgrimmar; relisting my auctions, and fighting a couple of Alliance frenemies that frequently visit the cliff above the AH.
I’ve also amassed more than 100k HKs on this toon since making it at the tail end of Legion, which is a pretty solid indicator that I’m not just “afking to pump my time played metrics.”
Why is it so difficult for you to accept that I’m an actual survival main who actually enjoys the spec and has actually spent more time playing it in the past 3 years than you have?
Argue against the content of their posts instead of using personal attacks constantly then? You quickly began making assumptions about them, which I don’t think is a great way to convince people about melee SV.
For the record, I do believe melee SV was a mistake. I don’t think they should revert it at this point and cause the same issue that range SV players complained about. I believe fourth spec would be the most appropriate fix, though I understand why others want to see a revert to melee SV since it seems rather unlikely blizz will do 4th specs for anyone besides druids.
I don’t care about convincing you of anything, I’m simply telling you that if you don’t enjoy MSV, you’re not its intended audience. You don’t have to like it, but you’re gonna have to accept it.
The devs are on record calling it a niche spec that’s not meant to appeal to everyone.
For the record, I do believe melee SV was a mistake.
For the record, I do not care. You still have access to ranged playstyles, and expecting a return to an EXACT version of a spec that existed in the past is not realistic; this is a living game, and specs are routinely reworked. MoP and WoD era surv aren’t coming back, but you still have plenty of ranged options to explore.
I don’t know why hunters are so mindnumbingly repetitive about stuff like this. Most other class forums realize this is part of the game. I mained WW in MoP and was deeply in love with its first itteration and spinning fire blossom. That spec and playstyle are gone, and they’re not coming back, and I’m not going to spam the monk forums about it asking that my nostalgia be granted extra credit. I simply accepted that WW monk is no longer the spec for me and moved on.
Just like I did with combat/outlaw rogues.
Just like you should with survival.
I mean, it’s a discussion forum. I think actually working to make compelling arguments will help people see the point you’re trying to make is all I’m saying. Personal attacks come off as aggressive and aren’t exactly convincing.
I mean, okay then?
I never made the claim that it should, or that I would ever expect it to be the same man.
It’s a tried and played out topic.
MSV players like our spec.
People that don’t play MSV want to see the spec changed in a thousand different directions to fit their own personal visions of the spec.
Most of the latter group of people spend more time posting on the forums than playing the game.
We’ve been in this cycle for literally years at this point. There is no convincing to be done.
Honestly that is why I try to stay out of the “MSV sucks conversation”.
You have a population of players that want RSV back no matter , which is fine, you are entitled to your opinion, your posts etc… But for most of that player base no buff or change to MSV (except for SV going ranged again) is ever going to convince them of the viability of MSV or heck even the existence of MSV as being “okay”. If blizzard was to buff MSV to be top melee dps or if MSV was given some unique buff or if WoW went on for 8 more years and SV still stayed melee, you would still have the “we want ranged SV back, screw MSV” crowd and I guarantee you that crowd will never come around to the idea of MSV. So honestly it is pointless to argue, to convince, to have some constructive dialogue about how can we improve MSV when you have part of the player base who is already strongly biased against MSV. Don’t get dragged into an argument where from the onset, the otherside has already dismissed your argument as nonviable.
Right now MSV is still a thing, whether it stays melee next expansion, I have no idea (but I hope it does) but for now for this expansion MSV still exists and if there is a major problem with the rotation, playstyle, dps etc… then I am sure, I would hope that blizzard would make adjustments.
Ah, fair enough. Yeah, no clue what to expect after SL honestly.
I suspect melee SV will stay, I quite frankly don’t see Blizz changing their stance on the issue unless devs or game philosophy changes within that time frame for the expansion after SL.
I hope it stays melee. But if blizz wanted to change it back to ranged, it would probably be the easiest thing to do that would be accepted by the playerbase with little argument. At least easier in the sense that players would be more accepting of SV going ranged again as opposed to saying "well the arcane mage spec is now being reworked to be a tank spec in World of warcaft “insert expansion name”
Yeah. I mean, as I mentioned earlier, I think making such a drastic change in the first place was a mistake of its own. But it’s already happened and really disagree with doing the same to those who enjoy melee SV.
I’m mostly hoping for 4th specs eventually, but that’s basically just a pipe dream.
I don’t mind a melee build for hunters, but the way Blizz left SV is just wrong, sh*t rotation combined with a bunch of skills that sucks, serpent sting with that crossbow, little fire bomb that will never be even close to Explosive Trap and of course removing flank strike in favor of kill command…
It’s obvious Blizz have no idea what to do with SV or how to fix it… Not only SV but the game as a whole get worse and worse with every exp…
I echo the above poster. I don’t mind hunters having a melee build either, but I’m not crazy with how they designed it. Mongoose should be baseline and replaced with a decent talent. Raptor should be changed to work in the spec along with mongoose giving ot another decent melee ability to use.
The chasing 5 stacks of MB isn’t the most creative thing as far as a fun and functional melee spec. Having to refresh serpent and bombs so often isn’t very fun either. I feel like they definitely missed the mark designing a melee spec for hunters, especially when it came at the expense of ranged SV which many loved. They could have came up with something better than 5 stack MB and refreshing a sting or bomb every 2 seconds.
With the loss of rental powers, much of SLs will feel like the original Street Fighter compared to its turbo or championship editions, expect a very sluggish monotonous spec for a good portion of SLs. Until you get more haste and rental powers that will boost the spec so its actually playable.
It’s really sad how bad Blizz is with class design with BFA and now SLs, how rental powers factor in and many classes playing like hot garbage right from the get go. That’s the way they’ve taken this once amazing game, so you either like, hate, or simply tolerate it while trying to find anything fun to you that remains.