Slice and Dice fix?

And you clear don’t understand how that graph works. It’s a percentage of the people playing those specs.

Everyone who raids with any effort is playing outlaw.

You’re clearly out of your depth here

So everyone is leaving sub behind because it’s better dps? Gee wiz you sure are credible!

People aren’t playing sub or sin in mythic because outlaw is better.

Reading comprehension is important my guy.

Just stick to being bad in pvp and LFR :+1:

More like Mr. IMakeThingsUp until someone posts actual data

Also if people don’t play outlaw they ar replaying sim over sub because sim does more damage while dealing with fight mechanics due to the extra bleed.

Sub still sims higher but sin is better for progression when they are close to the point of being within 2%

Yet you don’t understand the data you’re posting.

There’s sim data and there’s practicality data.

Sub sims higher
Sin is more practicalthan sub for mythic due to mechanics
Outlaw is the default for mythic raiding.

You can setup sims to take mechanics into account. You are probably looking at patchwerk sims.

Why is that an issue? Really, I would like to know why making something easier is a problem for you. WoW is not a competitive game, it is a cooperative game, especially the pve aspect of WoW. You should be excited when your fellow players are doing well, not bristly and gatekeepy.

I think you should take a different perspective instead of calling it a “dumbing down” of the game. In reality, fewer buttons means less upkeep, and the monkeys who run the game can allow it to be a self-sustaining project while they work on the next crappy expansion. Be more cynical. The truth is out there. :eyes:

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You can set up mechanics in simulations, but those mechanics are usually generic. It’s way too much work for too little return to set up specific simulations for each major encounter.

Live results are usually somewhat close, but not perfectly reflected in actual parses that get posted for that reason.

Edit: It’s also worth noting that simulations typically gauge perfect execution (or close to it). In practice, some specs are punished more harshly than others for mistakes. In some cases, this can make all the difference in the world for progression when compared to content on farm.

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Wow is 100% a competitive game. When you’re fighting for a raid spot or trying to get a top spot on logs it’s 100% competitive.

Do you raid at a mythic level?

There needs to be separation between good players and bad players. When the spec is dumbed down it means that there’s no distinction between person A who manages snd rupture and shiv perfectly while pooling energy properly to person B who spams abilities brainlessly.

In BFA if equal gear the difference between a good rogue and a bad rogue was 1.3% if I remember correctly. That’s how much of a difference between proper use of TB and improper use of TB and that is an issue.

In BFA last tier I played a mage. (I had come back to the game and they had filled the rogue position on the team)

I was behind in gear but actually did more dps than one of the other mages because he would mess up his combust windows and I didn’t even though he had full mastery corruptions and I didn’t.

:roll_eyes:

And then you immediately start talking about dps lol. Raiding at a mythic level, “good dps” is a given. The way you distinguish a good player from a bad player at that point is how well they follow directions and stay alive. Because this is a cooperative, team-oriented game. Fighting for a raid spot is not a competition, it’s a mismanaged guild roster, and it has nothing to do with the difficulty of your class or the game at large. What a silly way to view things.

I will say that fighting for a raid spot is a valid concern when you play a dime-a-dozen melee dps with zero raid utility or versatility. That’s a problem. But that’s poor game design, not difficulty or competitiveness.

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So it looks like your roster didn’t have good players after all. Probably because it’s hard to maintain a mythic raiding roster in a crappy, dying game. In a dying genre. Again, this doesn’t make WoW raiding a competitive scene. It’s poorly designed. Think about it. taps head

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I’m a lost cause. :sob:

Maybe in a cutthroat, world-first raiding environment. Mythic can be done casually too, and personally, as a very average player, I have never had to fight for a raid spot. I do middle of the road dps most of the time. Still got CE, sometimes even realm firsts, because I pay attention and follow directions. Raiding is about working with your team, not doing the most dps. These are fundamentals. I would hate to raid in the kind of guild Snoz is referring to – especially when he admits himself that the other players were not even good by his standards. Yikes!

My last serious guild was in Legion. 2 nights a week, 2 hours a night, and we got all CE. I was there probably like #8 or #9 on the dps chart for Mythic Argus. Never once feared I could lose my raid spot. :woman_shrugging:

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Most mythic teams have a 25 man roster so you’re still fighting for a spot.

I play on a two night casual team because of work and family. That doesn’t mean we don’t take it somewhat seriously.

A LOT of people were carried by gear the last tier of BFA and I am also against that.

I personally am also a very competitive person. I want to be top 5 dps every pull. It’s why I listen to theory crafting videos on YouTube while I drive from job to job at work. That’s just how I am.

When people put work into something they should see a return not just doing the same mediocre dps as someone that doesn’t put any effort into it.

It’s why I can’t take people complaining about SnD in the rotation when they aren’t even ilvl 200 and have 8% haste seriously.

I think games should never be balanced around bad players.

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The hardest part of mythic raiding is getting 20-25 like minded people with the same schedule that can follow directions and mesh together.

My old guild in BFA had like 87 wipes on mythic Xanesh because we had people learning the fight and I’m fine with that.

However we had to bench a priest healer because after 30+ wipes because she couldn’t get in the correct ritual spot and took the RL explaining what she was doing wrong as an “attack” and quit the guild.

Okay well. WoW is meant to be an accessible game for anyone and everyone. This isn’t balancing around “bad players,” it’s marketing at best and apathy at worst. Whatever you’re perceiving is not some conscious decision to make the game dumber, in any case.

So you are at least aware that this is you and not the way the game is designed. The competitive aspect of the game, if there is one at all (aside from lol WF race), is not out-dpsing your guild mates so you get a raid spot. That’s something people made up because of egos.

Or that’s just a standard on any team, ever, in the existence of history? Who is fighting for a spot? I think our roster had upwards of 30 people and more of them were fighting for the bench than for anything else. :joy_cat: People were rotated in based on which bosses they needed, because we were a team trying to achieve a common goal together.

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Wow is an accessible game. That doesn’t mean it has to be accessible to anyone even if they perform poorly.

In BC or wrath would you ever take someone with 71 points in one tree to a progression raid? No. That’s what LFR is for.

If you want to push and min max is who the game should be balanced around.

Not trying to get brain dead Ted into
Mythic.

I’m competitive because I want to progress. I want to not get stuck at early
Bosses because not everyone is on the same page.

If brain dead Ted can’t do a rotation without cttc what makes you think he can do mechanics and do damage.

Doing good damage and doing it while doing mechanics properly is what makes a good player. Just doing one or the other isn’t enough.

Where did this strange comparison come from? I’m failing to see the connection between a player putting 71 points into 1 talent tree and a player who thinks pressing the Slice and Dice button every 40 seconds is redundant in the year 2021.

Anyway, that’s not enough information. If “brain dead Ted” can follow directions, stay alive, and execute his dps rotation, then he’s invited. If he can’t, then no. I don’t care how easy the rotation is. Why should you?

Yeah if you’re in the WF race and you get paid to play this game, I guess. Anyone else is just a tryhard nerd. >.> Sarcasm but deep down, there is truth. I forgot to mention that in all my CE raiding, I played assassination, the worst of all our specs. Somehow, some way, we managed to kill the bosses. Fancy that.

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