Right and making friends isn’t going to be easy in a Venthyr or bust community. They don’t owe you anything. If you show you’re clearly not interested in winning (by picking an inferior covenant) then they have no obligation to go along with it.
That isn’t to say they won’t. I suppose it happens but to act like it’s going to be commonplace when we’ve seen the exact opposite is foolish.
This is the entire issue with rental power. It’s not cheaper it’s actually more expensive and we’ve seen this play out again and again and again. You first introduce a bunch of stuff because classes are hollow that must now be recycled every new expansion. Massive holes need to be backfilled because people want things to stick around and classes remain broken for too long. It’s now not just the cost of development it’s the cost of losing customers because you turned their favorite spec into garbage.
Yes, very much so signature abilities should be removed. That is the most cost effective decision at this point.
Everyone gets something new in the form of the story and cosmetics. I’ve no idea why they need more. Of course I do think classes are hollow right now and could get a major MoP-style return to power. That should be their focus.
I guess adding new passives can work to introduce new spec builds but really the rental power thing is a bad idea.
Yep I’m right there with you on the preorder. I haven’t preordered and won’t. Not until I see real movement on rep tabards or some equivalent system to bypass the WQ experience. I will NOT subject myself to that again.
As for the other comment I disagree. I think there are going to be legit issues with the Venthyr ability at launch and well into the future until they gut it and anger a lot more players.
That sounds good on paper. In practice we know it’s not like that at all. People are largely selfish and don’t owe anyone their time if that person willingly plays an inferior build.
Ask yourself how many affliction locks are getting M+ invites. Start there and see what I’m talking about already.
A) It wasn’t Warlocks, it was entire raid groups.
B) It wasn’t abusing, they weren’t exploiting anything. They were just using their tools in creative ways.
Use to, now it’s DHs. Again people act like MDI groups are the only thing that people use. I can promise if I check out your raider IO page I will see a variety of classes unless every run you did was just 3 rogues?
It’s sad the community overall is a toxic cesspool but there are nice people who play this game that aren’t elitists and don’t ostracise players for their choices when it comes to spec(Affliction locks are balls though) or experiences.
The thing is though if you really really want something like R1 or to be a mythic raider you might not have the choice to do whatever you want. It’s just the nature of this game and has been since it’s inception when it comes to balance. Balance doesn’t exist. There will always be a meta. You either learn to play within it, attempt to break it with superior skill or not give a crap.
When I first rolled this Pally at the start of TBC I became like every Pally in existence and fell in love with Ret. It was a trash spec back then but I loved playing it. I also wanted to get into one of the top raiding guilds on my server and get gladiator. The only way to do either was to play as a Holy Paladin which I did to achieve my goals. Got Glad in S1 as a holy , killed Lady Vashj raiding and then quit the game as I moved to the UK for school. When I came home/back to WoW I just said screw it I’m going to have fun with my friends and play Ret. I knew there was no way I would get glad again in S4 as ret, or be a top raider but I still managed to have fun in casual content until Wrath came out and I went back to my Vanilla Warrior.
TLDR your goals in this game might not always line up with how you want to play it depending on who you’re playing the game with.
I don’t see it as toxic myself. I think people are rightfully saying their time is worth more to them than that. Knowing they need you at 100% but you’re 75% because you chose an inferior covenant isn’t a strong selling point for their time.
In more basic terms it’d be like going into a party in EQ, as a cleric and telling the group “sorry I lost my CH keybind so it’s just going to be other heals for now.” That would never fly. Not then and not now. If people knowingly go with something that makes all group content much harder they’re on their own to find groups. Many of them won’t.
That’s when the concrete has been poured and the rebar is missing. It’s not a do over at that point it’s a ride it out for what it’s worth moment.
The concete hasn’t been poured yet and we can still see from the rebar that it’s a failed idea. All we’re saying is it’s better to fix that now than to pour the concrete and pretend it’ll all be fine. We know it won’t.
Mind it isn’t to say balance will always be perfect but take a hard look at the 4 signature abilities. There’s no semblance of balance in that. None at all. It’s not like they tried. Obviously they weren’t thinking of balance when those got slapped together.
Yes, you will always have to adapt somewhat to the people around you if you want certain rewards. That doesn’t mean signature abilities from convents are a good system. Alpha is as good a time as any to be vocal about that.
And so we must ask; are there Vulpera mythic raiders? Are there Vulpera high key M+ runners, and Vulpera arena champions? There probably are. By the logic of many in this thread, all Vulpera should be denied access to content because they’re “suboptimal” with racials that “don’t contribute”, yet that’s not happening.
It’ll be the same deal with covenants. It’ll be fine, relax y’all.
the choice should only be lore and cosmetics. There should have never been different covenant abilities for the same class. Should have been 1 ability per class so players could be free to make the choice they want
Some people did that, sure. I wouldn’t say they were forced to do it. Who forced them?
Wrong. Blizzard actually did break the cookie cutter with legendaries and azerite, by making it so you LITERALLY COULDN’T pick some option if it hadn’t first RNG dropped for you. People actually used different builds, because it was all they had.
There was a ton of collateral damage, though. Every person who wanted to run the Simcraft-approved build but didn’t have the right drops for it screamed endlessly. Some people hated those entire expansions for that reason. But whether you think it was worth it or not, you can’t say it wasn’t a different system than talents.
Yes, you can. What you can’t create is “every choice is the optimal choice”, because the definition of optimal is that in the end, there can be only one.
The issue is for players who can’t distinguish between good and optimal because they believe anything that isn’t optimal is automatically bad.
Because the first thing you sacrifice on the altar of optimality is free choice, and the second is any variety from one player to another.
Want to be good enough to beat the content. That leaves enough room for variety, experimentation, and fun, and you still get to beat the content and accomplish things.
(Yes, I know, telling people what to want is probably going to be ineffective at best. But people who insist on pursuing optimization past necessity and into obsession are exactly why we can’t have nice things interesting game systems.)
Except all of your points are wrong, they cannot make every choice a good choice, let’s ignore the utility signiature abilities for a moment and look at the class abilities, you are telling me that it is okay for a player to be stuck playing one maybe two of their specs brut not the third because the ability is actually garbage for other specs in their class? That should I want to play enhancement shaman then too bad because I will never get into 3v3 groups because my covenant ability is only good for elemental or restoration to the point I will actually be a detriment to a team, and furthermore no matter what spec I play I will hold back m+ or raid teams so I won’t get invited to those either, there is no every choice is good because the abilities cannot be good for every spec of every class, and remember this is ignoring the utility abilities of each covenant which will make the problem even worse, story and theme should not be tied to player power like this because there is no way to make every choice good
You don’t do high level content anyway though. You do occasional keys and get aotc. I’m not telling you to play different but those don’t exactly require high level play or skips etc to do. It won’t matter for you either way. For me it will and changing it so it doesn’t hinder me doesn’t change anything for you. It’s win win.
except it is game breaking, they had to change m+ because of rogue and nerf lock portal a couple times because it was trivializing mechanics in ways that were not intended, you are literally being obstinate
