So to you, any reparations done by the Horde to the Alliance would hurt them. and you want to kick our teeth in yet again, without the Alliance being able to fight back, for the Third time in the game’s history.
Great suggestions.
And you dare speak of the Alliance offering concessions for Zandalar, without even mentioning any the Horde could give?
This is borderline trolling. Get serious.
It’s not mutually exclusive. Maybe none of us should be paying subscriptions?
Say you get everything you want, and the Horde is reminded of the guilt of Teldrassil every time they log in.
Why do you expect people to pay for the privilege of that experience?
Flipping the situation, as you did, only acknowledges that paying to be made to feel bad (whether it’s because of guilt or unresolved anger) is something nobody should do. It doesn’t actually answer the question.
I do dare because I wrote what I did with YOUR reparations in mind in Ashenvale. They mirror each other.
And yes, a lot does come at the expense of the Alliance because that’s the way the world is set up. Much of the Forest Trolls ancestral land is held by the Alliance, with the rest under Horde control such as the Ghostlands.
The Forsaken are in desperate need of detachment from the Alliance. Calia is the issue. We’re stuck with Calia. So that means the Alliance will have to do something for her to cut that tie.
Asking for cutscenes of Horde characters being heroes to our faction and performing heroic deeds without getting themselves killed is trolling? Cool.
Then go down the route of war. No peace, just an armistice. Have the war start again in the future, with the Alliance fighting more brutally than ever, and the Horde Trying to weather the attack.
I don’t even know. All I know is that I don’t want Teldrassil to be forgotten. Either we get a resolution, or the effects continue to be felt.
I don’t see how that will help. You can’t be accepting that you deserve to suffer for what your faction did and righteously fighting to defend yourself at the same time. That’s why “Have the Alliance get ultra-aggressive” has never worked for me as a way out of the whole mess and why I can’t get excited about the idea of Turalyon/Yrel going “Lux Vult” in a future expansion.
After what the Horde has done, how do you think it would feel for Alliance players to watch them being heroic, as they kick our teeth in for the third time. Try and imagine it. It’s every bit as infuriating as you can imagine.
I didn’t realize that the Alliance was occupying Zandalar. But sure, i’m perfectly fine with them leaving, as long as the Horde leaves Ashenvale.
I’m fine with giving land to the forest trolls. just send them to Silvermoon. I’m sure there’s pletny of space with so few elves. And in return, why don’t we start chopping up a few orcs, to make ammends to the Draenei they killed.
Then the only option is reconcilliation. You can’t ignore Teldrassil, no more than you can ignore the other events through the game’s history.
Your version basically ignores Teldrassil, pretends that the Horde somehow are justified in kicking our teeth in even more, all the while giving us the Alliance absolutely nothing. And you speak of Horde players leaving the game.
Okay, how do you see that happening?
And I repeat: why, then, should I not just cancel my subscription and leave?
What, pray tell, is “my version”? I have not presented any “version” of how things should go. I have simply asked how you expect constant guilt to be fun enough to justify a subscription to the game, which you have not yet answered.
How does that feel? Was it the same as watching Malfurion burying an orc alive? Maybe Jaina blowing up our city walls and dispelling our superweapon atop the Flying Dutchman? Varian going out in a heroic blaze of glory?
All you’ve proven is that you’re unwilling to deal in anything.
We can’t even have a cutscene of Rokhan being a BAMF because of Teldrassil? Sod off with that.
(Observation): In other words, we keep asking the unanswerable question.
(Commentary): Well, not unanswerable. There is an answer. A reboot. Fat chance of it happening though.
I mean, obviously it’s not to the same scale, but that kinda already happened with Jaina when throughout the expansion, the horde player goes from watching her pummel Lordaeron with her magic boat, to running away from both her and Genn in the silly Stormwind Extraction scenario, to having to fight against them when they’re righteously angry with you, only to turn around and have to temporarily ally with them both in Nazjatar before Jaina assists you in another horde-side face turn with the Baine stuff. And then it’s going to happen again with Jaina in the Maw scenario, according to Shadowlands datamining.
And I don’t even get the imaginary balm of having any moral highground to dislike them. 
As bad as watching a city you love getting torched, with all of it’s inhabitants inside. All the While knowing you will not be allowed to have any meaningful vengeance against the ones who did it.
And multiply that feeling by a million.
By having the Horde and Alliance work together, with a special focus on the horde helping the Night elves rebuild.
That’s what i’ve got. I can’t think of any other solution.
No wait, I do actually. Mass ress everyone who died at Teldrassil. And at this point it seems to be the only solution.
Cool. I lost Undercity, which I was fond of. I’ll never get closure on that because the person responsible is likely slated to die for NE justice.
You’re not willing to give the Horde anything, yet ask for things in return. You don’t want any more to happen to you, but are perfectly happy inflicting misery on the other side.
I offered up the easiest solution. Horde heroes being heroes. Being the strength and honor faction again. Even in neutral content. And you denied that.
If I deserve nothing, you deserve nothing.
Let me ask you. What’s in it for the Alliance in your “easy solution”. We get to have fun being punching bags? perhaps lose a few more territories, because we didn’t lose enough during the cataclysm? Tell me, what do we get?
Since you brought it up a couple of times, Morghel, maybe I’m just weird but I honestly don’t think that even mass rezzing all of Teldrassil would still be enough to undo the story damage BFA has caused. Unless the character goes around and raises every person who has died as a result of the 4th war, then there’s still a ton of casualties of war that were written as the result of the horde being a giant crapsack yet again. And it wouldn’t undo the suffering from time spent in the maw either. It’s an insurmountable moral deficit.
It’s honestly enough for me. Because if they do, our losses become rougly equal, and the greatest injstice of that war is resolved. I can’t ask for more than that.
You get your Ashenvale scenario where I have to swallow my pride and help you rebuild your lands instead of my own.
All you trade off is Horde characters taking the lead in neutral content for an xpac or two. Being the heroes you follow around, performing epic deeds in the cutscenes that drive the story. You see things like Rokhan channeling the Loa and obliterating a zone villain, Voss clashing with Sylvanas atop Torghast to confront her over her abandonment of the Forsaken, Gazlowe entering the battlefield atop a custom shredder and firing off crazy contraptions to turn the tide of battle. Fun stuff that looks cool and builds our characters into respectable powerhouses that can hold their own against these universal level threats.
Now let me ask you a question. The Horde gains in Cataclysm were done to balance an unfair distribution in the Alliance’s favor. Would you have preferred the Horde have been given entirely new built-from-scratch zones, or would you have complained that the Horde got new playthings and you didn’t? What would you have done to give the Horde a level playing field?
Without a doubt I would have preferred that the Horde gained new zones. As many as they want. I have never had a problem with the Horde gaining something. I have allways had a problem with the Horde taking things from the Alliance.
I’m actually quite fine with the scenario you outlined. The Horde puts time and resources into helping the ones they hurt, and they also get to show that they are heroes and badass. perfectly fine with that.
Of course, it would require a fair ammount of helping to make up for Teldrassil. And For the Horde to fight something that isn’t the Alliance.
I’m curious if you mean Horde NPCs, or Horde players?