Not really. Its just they suck at everything but tank healing.
Aces in 5s Arena tho.
Gotta love people that have only playing pserver trying to theorycraft.
Imagine thinking only the Meta classes can be considered “useful”
And then imagine saying it when you have GREY PARSES lol you’re doing less dps than a classic ret on some boss fights time to stop acting like an elitist 
What do mean everything but tank healing? Do they suck at buffing? I think what you mean is they just aren’t effective raid healers.
I mean, they don’t buff any better than non-holy paladins. So yeah, toss buffing on the list too. Its not a reason to bring one.
You bring holy pally cause they your friend or you dont have other healers or they are just a really good player. Not because holy pally is any good.
They just struggle to keep up in sloppy groups. Especially noticeable in Heroic dungeons.
I mean if you’re min/maxing that hard you’re not bringing a Paladin tank at all you’re running 1 warrior 1 druid so ya, you’d still need 1 ret.
O shoot, grats on getting sapphiron down dude!
Its so cool that more guilds are getting up there on our dad server
Whether or not ret will be great in TBC, or merely OK, or even bad, is secondary to the main point this thread raises:
Replacing the vanilla-like 400ms batching window with wod/legion/bfa/shadowlands 1-10ms server response is a fundamental change to the game mechanics that will change the way classes are played! One a fundamental level that matters even more than the (in many cases, large) implications for balance!
To the ignorant mob who have been crying and crying about this: be careful what you wish for! You are opening Pandora’s Box and you do not fully understand the implications.
People like the OP are so concerned about trying to min-max other people’s raids lol.
1 Like
By the way the guys on the paladin discord have been saying that seal twisting still works on the PTR so GG
Well it would seem they have specifically given a buffer from the latest blue to make sure seal twisting stays. I am impressed and will roll a ret. You have been reading my posts, Blizzard. Or someone has, and took some initiative. That’s good to see.
Whew. This aged well.
Since day 1 people have said the way Blizzard implemented Classic batching is nothing like the way it was in Vanilla or private servers.
It is a fundamental change in how things will work moving foward but the horrible 400ms window they put in Classic was also a fundamental change for the worse.
Having batching apply to things like vendors and leeway was one of the stupidest changes Blizzard made to classic.
Then you played with idiots.
H Paladins patch heal better than any other class. Ie patch heal = 1.8s heal or less in interval.
Also contrary to rumor Holy Paladins with the use of Libram of Absolute Truth + SA can utilize Rank 7 HL + BoL to breach 2k HP/sec.
It is less than CoH and Chain Heal…sure…but it’s still capable of healing either the Feral/Hunter/Resto Group, or your Tank Group minus the tank that’s actually tanking at that moment.
Should a Raid ever bring more than 2 Holy Paladins?..probably not. Especially if they have a tankadin who also has an FoL set when not tanking. Outside of that they are the best at what they do.
Don’t blame the class because you raid with people who don’t even understand their own class.
As to Ret and not twisting
Ret Paladin DPS started slow until Patch 2.3 and 2.3.2.
After that they were fine, even without twisting.
The fact that people can’t even remember to differentiate that means you really have no idea what your talking about.
Even Prots started behind the 8 ball a bit in raids until Weapon Expertise was changed to Combat Expertise and Tankadins gained far more HP scaling and EH.
3 Likes
So I have been leveling a paladin somewhat slowly, and even consulted the paladin discord and they said effectively that seal twisting as it was possible in TBC and allegedly in Vanilla does not work in Classic. They showed me that you can twist some seals, but command and righteousness aren’t possible because the way the client works is different.
Was doing my best to paraphrase what was a very long dialog.
TL;DR doesn’t work in classic anyway and unlikely to work in TBC.
Kinda for the best anyway because it’s a sharp nerf to the BELF horde specific seal and by default a buff to alliance TBC PvE, and doesn’t matter in Arena.
Here’s the news you apparently missed.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/wow-classic-version-1137-ptr-is-now-available/838945/169
Oh wow! That’s actually really cool, but my question now is will Seal of Command and SoR properly work? On live as of a week ago on my last attempt to make it work, it simply doesn’t work as described by Vanilla paladins.
When I asked what I was doing wrong they said that I wasn’t and that it’s the classic client. So does this fix the problem that has existed for those seals in classic since allegedly day one of Classic?
It should fix this for alliance, though it will not be as good as SoB for horde. You will viable, however. And alliance paladins get Crusader Strike with the new talents on prepatch day, along with 3% raidwide crit. Instantly viable then.
Yeah I knew about the class update, and familiar with TBC paladin but the classic version has me asking loads of questions. Strange as it sounds, Wrath actually turned me off to paladin because it went from a class that was in my opinion very unique and interesting in Tbc, and IMO incomplete yet interesting in classic to basically just a warrior with a blue rage bar… at that point why play paladin? So I went back to playing basically only my rogue (Wrath+) due to the over homogenization.
The Holy Power change in Cata is what turned me off. Played ret in Legion and it was pretty good DPS wise but hated the playstyle.