They were never intended for raids, all the content is doable without them.
They create problems with raid logging, massive server drama, BRM lagging out because of groups trying to kill eachother over them.
The only positive is that they allow you to have big numbers when you don’t lose them, but it’s all relative without world buffs we’d all be on a level playing field.
Some of the fights would also be more interesting without them, none would be particularly hard but at least they wouldn’t fall over in 30 seconds.
It would also serve to lower the gap between melee and everyone else.
65 Likes
I’m not interested in playing a hardmode hack of classic.
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I can agree with this. It feels more and more tedious each week, especially now that we have even more to get.
DM
Songflower
ZG
Ony/Nef
Darkmoon Faire
It’s such a huge morale hit to the raid if you wipe and lose the buffs too.
34 Likes
Most guilds already lose their buffs to a wipe anyways, all it does is further separate the top 1%. In actual vanilla there was nowhere near this much accessibility to world buffs, so you can’t really say it’s a hard mode.
@miley the list doesn’t even end there, we’re about to be adding in the silithus buff too, there’s also the ubrs fire res buff, and the diamond flask battle shout.
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[Citation Needed]
That’s the players not the buffs.
PvP happening on a PvP server.
So, according to you the only difference between guilds clearing BWL in 30 minutes and guilds that struggle to break 3 hours is world buffs?
Yeah, ok.
Have your entire raid remove 1 piece of gear. Do the raid. If you have not achieved the difficulty you were going for remove an additional piece of gear. Repeat.
Until the next phase maybe.
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Either the buffs are too powerful, or the game doesn’t become easier with them.
You don’t get to pick both.
I’m not interested in playing a harder version of the game. I like the difficulty where it is.
1 Like
there’s your citation on them not being intended for raids. They were just intended to be cool alternative quest rewards.
A full bis BWL player with r14 and no world buffs will be beat by preraid bis phase 1 warrior with world buffs. And by no small margin, they’re putting people an expansion ahead on damage when stacked.
15% crit
15 all stats
510 attack power
15% haste
15% increased damage
not to mention the defensive gains
also I don’t think you understand what a level playing field means. Guilds taking 30 minutes and guilds taking 3 hours have many differences but without world buffs there’s nothing external that separates them only things that can be activated and decisions that can be made during the raid.
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Without calling people out by name, I know of a situation on a major server where a raid leader randomly called for his raid to log on one night to get buffs since DMF was around and they wanted to get buffs late at night when there was less of a chance of dispels happening, and they wanted to do a try-hard BWL that week.
It took hours, and hours, and hours for them to get everyone (those who actually saw the announcement and logged on) to DM, get buffs, get everyone to DMF, get buffed, then get everyone left (about half were around by this point because it was taking so long) to Felwood for songflower. The raid leader had a single buff dispelled on the way to the song flower they wanted, and absolutely lost his mind, started banning people from the raid group and kicking people from the new guild he had just formed-he blamed a major guild on the server for flaming the dispel/purge war with the opposing faction, and started blacklisting people from that guild, even if they had nothing to do with it and were good, regular raiders who showed up buffed/flasked every week. I used to see anger like that in LoL, where people get SUPER mad about the dumbest things, but I guess in Vanilla I just never experienced that sort of thing, and it’s disappointing to see people act like that in Classic…over a single buff.
He and a few others ended up rage transferring from the server after that.
And I say this as someone who really doens’t mind flasking/buffing, as long as it’s not made into a job, and as long as people don’t roid rage over it. It’s fine as it is. Not required, but those who want to try-hard have the ability to do so if they choose.
2 Likes
I agree on this.
They are so powerfull, it feel like doing raids with a TBC character minus the level difference
But sorry OP, all we can see on these forums are players asking to make the game easier than it is already… No one is asking for change to get a better “Vanilla experience”.
They love faceroll and stomp the raid content to feel powerful. They are even asking to make Worldbuff non-purgable
So, when your raid wipe once, you stop and try again the next day ?
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I’m actually on board with this and parses might actually mean something without them.
Currently its just whoever stacks the most wbuffs. Some of us simply dont have the time for all that and would like to see how we stack up to others without already being at a disadvantage.
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You’re telling me buffs that you get from doing raids were never intended to be used when doing raids? Lol I’m calling bulls*** on that one.
That’s completely subjective. Many people enjoy short fights, many enjoy longer fights. Trying to say fights are better for everyone if played unbuffed is purely an opinion. And a bad one in my opinion.
Yes, you are correct. No buff works after you no longer have it.
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Nope, of course not.
Doesn’t mean removing world buffs isn’t making it harder.
You can argue they are too strong/powerful, or you can argue the game isn’t made easier with them. Arguing both is a contradiction.
I already linked a clip showing that they weren’t intended to be stacked for raids.
Short fights can be interesting sure, but the vanilla fights weren’t designed to be destroyed this fast, they’re just trash mobs with more HP as they are atm. Even firemaw is being killed without anyone resetting stacks or even wearing FR.
Not sure why you felt the need to put the last part.
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That’s a pretty weak take, I personally have no problem getting them and I do every week, I just think they cause more issues than they’re worth (again not even for me, but for servers as a whole). It’s antithetical to actual vanilla gameplay, and no matter how many people you tell “just don’t get them” it’s not going to change that most guilds that are even remotely serious will require them unless they’re removed from raids.
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So, don’t join those guilds.
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You on tilt, Marty?
You sound like you’re on tilt.
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The intention is just as irrelevant as the intention of the 16 debuff limit or spell batching.
It’s vanilla. It’s Classic.
#NoChanges
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That doesn’t make sense. If everyone has all the world buffs, it’s not whoever stacks the most world buffs, is it?
You think the difference between #1 and #100 is the number of world buffs?
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