Remove titanforging

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

Hhhmm,that’s strange.

You should read up on the really big Titanforging thread and you can see it all there. I actually think Humanity just likes to stir up things on the forums a lot.

[Haavi-barthilas (Haavi)]

The problem is the can of worms from Mythic + they opened up. I mean they dug their own grave with that reward system. They have to cover a huge range of ilvl rewards because people who do higher keys expect better rewards as the difficulty increases and that’s what they get.

Not sure how to fix that at this point.

Too be honest, I would like to hear the opinions of top players who are pushing 18+…20+ keys in that regard.
I find it highly unlikely that they are pushing those numbers just for the increased chance of Titanforging on the 400 ilvl pieces that drop at the end.

Yeah, well we could talk about M+ as well. I have found that most people that are against WF/TF/Socket are also against M+.

I think it’s a little bit further away than socketing however it is valid.
One of the big problems with initial design in Legion was people spamming 3 chests on low keys simply for the increased chances of TF.

Honestly though if you reduced the impact of WF/TF/sockets it would also have a similar affect on M+, which in my opinion would personally be healthier for the game anyway.

[Gryff-drenden (Gryff)]

I am concernced about things that are fun.

I am honestly interested to understand what is so fun about a random system you have no control over and BiS pieces being almost unobtainable?

I was actually almost embarrassed when I got a LFR TF item and couldn’t even get a Heroic raid drop to ever roll high enough to replace it. It was constant disappointment. Not fun.

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

Honestly though if you reduced the impact of WF/TF/sockets it would also have a similar affect on M+, which in my opinion would personally be healthier for the game anyway.

It is cool for you to feel this way friend. I don’t see it causing any problems in the game myself and that is why I am fine leaving it the way it is.

[Haavi-barthilas (Haavi)]

Hhhmm,that’s strange.

There is a whole thing about the repeatability of M+ and how that interacts with TF which I believe is what he is referring to.
As well as M+ allowing an almost infinite supply of gear without the usual lockouts in general.

[Haavi-barthilas (Haavi)]

It is cool for you to feel this way friend. I don’t see it causing any problems in the game myself and that is why I am fine leaving it the way it is.

Appreciate the pleasant response

[Pyromor-shandris (Pyromor)]

Oh,no wonder.I was referring to repeated thread on the subject,which is about 4 as of now,all of which were about WQ430 gear and pvp.Op ,did mention 2200 rating and mythic raids.

It is fine for those that love to jumping head first ,which I’m sure in 8.2, they’ll would do.But now it’s wf/tf ?

[Marla-thorium-brotherhood (Marla)]

Theres not a finite amount of gear. Every 400+ level item that winds up in a filthy casual’s hands is not in any way depriving you of any gear whatsoever. For the life of me ill never figure out why so many “hardcores” get a hair up their hind end about how other people with no bearing on them olay the game.

PS - im i390 and climbing solely from WQs & warfronts with 2 or 3 LFR’s thrown in for funzies. I havent even done a single M-0 yet !!! Hopefully my ilvl makes some elitists rage quit

[Kaetliyn-shadowsong (Kaetliyn)]

So the fun is:

1. cool this thing I thought I was going to vendor trash may be useful
2. excitedly looks through bags for item
3. compares the item to existing gear hoping for an upgrade
4. yes an upgrade! From what i thought was going to be trash

See fun! TF/WF was not designed to be farmed nor probably even for the raiding crowd. It was designed to be fun and surprise you with a treat from time to time

Edit: Also it makes everything I do have potential value which is also fun.

[Hazeonix-sargeras]

I am a world quest warrior. My gear has not titanforged anywhere even close to heroic or mythic raid gear. It’s rare as hell. What now?

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

I am a world quest warrior. My gear has not titanforged anywhere even close to heroic or mythic raid gear. It’s rare as hell. What now?

I just want to ask you one question… Are you having fun?

[Pyromor-shandris (Pyromor)]

I still don’t see the point of fusing about ,it takes time to get a TF. Do some people start crying about a rare trinket drop someone else got?

[Kaetliyn-shadowsong (Kaetliyn)]

I do a lot of world quests to and the answer is yes, I am having fun with WQ, normal quests, and the occasional lfd.

I bet that guy would say the same thing or something similiar

[Inviscerate-thrall (Inviscerate)]

Mythic raid and pvp gear above 2200 rating should be the best gear and no gear from anything els should be able to even come close in ilvl.

But if you remove it “top guilds” will never kill anything

[Haavi-barthilas (Haavi)]

It’s got nothing to do with other people having gear. People need to get this out of their heads as the reason.

It’s the game mechanics it changes, for one instance, ilvl inflation is huge concern and with it the respective changes to itemisation.

For example Cata ilvls over 3 tiers of content itemisation went from 333 to 416 (Legendary Daggers) that is 83 ilvls over the course of a whole expansion, you can increase that to 127 if you add the base rewards from the level 80 starting quests.

Now look at BfA, itemisation is currently 305 to 425 already, that’s 120 ilvls, or if you go from the base rewards from the 110 quests 220 ilvls.

So we have more item levels so we get more powerful, but we can’t have infinitely scaling secondaries because they increase rating %, we would have already capped past our endgame stat % from past expansions before we even get onto our 3rd patch. So now instead they just cut the values of secondaries and stack on heaps of primary stat.

Now the issue here now is that classes scale differently with various stats, some classes need to reach breakpoints to be effective which are now further out of reach. So you have exaggerated the balance gap between classes even further by creating more polarised itemisation on gear.

[Pyromor-shandris (Pyromor)]

It would seem those guilds and solo raiders ,and pvpers ,would need more challenge to keep their mind supplied.

[Zyanya-ghostlands]

IMO you gave the best answer to this lingering over thought dilemma.

[Pyromor-shandris (Pyromor)]

So we have more item levels so we get more powerful, but we can’t have infinitely scaling secondaries because they increase rating %, we would have already capped past our endgame stat % from past expansions before we even get onto our 3rd patch. So now instead they just cut the values of secondaries and stack on heaps of primary stat.

Now the issue here now is that classes scale differently with various stats, some classes need to reach breakpoints to be effective which are now further out of reach. So you have exaggerated the balance gap between classes even further by creating more polarised itemisation on gear.

I agree,and this is the problem with class imbalances and the balance of pve/pvp.I f you change a pvp stat it changes the pve ,so if I were to pvp and those stats change to make me more powerful in my class ,or even a talent ,it would effect the pve version on my class.

Blizzard try to do just that in Bfa by removing secondaries from Azerite gear but it fall short and pvp is sure messed up.

Kind of think about it ,ohh that why they don’t want wf/tf.

[Gryff-drenden (Gryff)]

Edit: Also it makes everything I do have potential value which is also fun.

See and I completely disagree but we are all free to have our own opinions. That’s all they are but everything done having potential value is going too far in many regards. Again my opinion.

[Humanïty-sargeras]

Sub-2200 PVPer and non-Mythic raider complains about titanforging.

Im a hall of fame raider and 2.5k io what you talking about.