Hmmm, I don’t actually entirely agree with this fully. Don’t get me wrong, the numbers were still high in Cata and MoP, but they weren’t as high as what it was in Wrath.
people already do this with battlegrounds, you dont even need to click the battlemaster anymore.
say that to the DPS in queue, it didn’t kill diddly squat, people screaming “muh community” killed the open world.
try providing an example which justifies blizzards reasons for removing RDF, which is their core value of social experience.
just because you experienced it one way doesn’t mean every body else did; people choose to socialize with or without RDF.
people already dungeon exclusively to 70, i did it on my warrior in classic 15-60 without RDF, i did it on one of my dks from 59-70, the other dk i spent in battlegrounds 59-70
RDF isn’t going to change people leveling how they want, they already level how they want to and RDF doesn’t add any new avenue of leveling to the game.
that we can agree on with cross-realm zones being an issue; that will kill the open world; but you could say the same thing for cross-realm battlegrounds killing the open world for leveling now that people can choose to level in this way.
playing dungeons with people from other servers with RDF isn’t going to add anything new to the leveling experience, you will just have more players available to group just like how cross-realm battlegrounds work.
no, it’s just your opinion.
we aren’t talking about RDF in regards to expansions beyond WOTLK; all data points towards cataclysm being the first expansion to be unable to retain wow subscriptions. subscriptions only rose before then even with RDF in-game.
the question is, why are we not allowed to have RDF? do you agree with blizzard’s reasoning for removing it? social experience.
lol i know i was just kidding
yes before blizzard stopped publicizing their subscriber data, there is proof subscriber growth was 500k from 11million when wotlk launched, to 500k in growth to 12million before wotlk ended.
i’m just looking at the known data.
takes 0 minutes to travel to a battleground, nice feature if you ask me.
100% toxicity is brought on by the player, not any individual system or tool in the game.
the game already has an enter battleground button for leveling, what is your point?
dps still do quests while waiting in queue, just 1 example.
people already do this with cross-realm battlegrounds, RDF doesn’t add to or take away from that.
people have been doing this since vanilla classic, sorry to burst your troll bubble.
RDF doesn’t make it a small experience, people already choose how they want to level, in dungeons, in battlegrounds, in open world, getting boosted without moving; RDF doesn’t stop any of those avenues of leveling
people will actually be able to find groups for it if RDF is in. and be able to socialize with more people in BRD at that.
classic era is still available, this isn’t the forum for that; if you want to preach to the choir continue on trolling here over classic era.
you’re complaining about other people who play this game differently than you want to.
more players to socialize with than waiting around 20 minutes in your level range for anybody to show up on group browser.
people already level outside of the overworld, a large portion of people save their quests for level cap to go back and collect more gold from them, if they know what’s good for them.
because they are in queue, because they want gold or certain loot from quests.
subs were at their highest from beginning of wrath to the end, 11m at wotlk launch, 12m at the end of wotlk, plummets started after cataclysm and then blizzard stopped reporting their subscription numbers, the proof is in the pudding sorry you didnt bring your spoon.
sounds familiar.
doesn’t matter if they did or not, the way they are going about this change contradicts their reasons for removing it in the first place, which this topic is trying to draw attention to.
bye dont let the door hit you on the way out.
the door is that way.
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Nope.
You’ll still have tanks or plate wearers that’ll curate who they want for the dungeon to make sure all the loot goes to them.
Just like how you’ll get mages and “spellcleave” people that only want classes with aoe for fast runs.
exactly why incentivizing tanks/healers to do dungeons by giving the pets, mounts, consumables, gold is a bad thing.
btw you can still spam dungeons level 15-70, you can even spam battlegrounds from 10-70 without even visiting a battlemaster.
RDF doesn’t add on or take away from either of those leveling paths; saying RFD is the path of least resistance to leveling is hilarious as it only gives you more people to play with, people will still level how they want such as paths of least resistance without RDF.
we all know the path of the least resistance is that shiny level 70 boost, so your example of how RDF ruins the leveling experience is pretty moot.
For me I think I’m over the « it’s good or bad » debate. RDF has its positive, and it has its downsides. In the end, it comes down to personal preferences when it comes to how we enjoy playing mmorpgs. I prefer a more old school type of approach, while others prefer a more modern approach to it. Not one is better than the other, they are just different.
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I never said that, and you’re taking what I said out of context. The person I was quote replying to said, “Enable both tools, let the players decide in-game how they want to play” - and if given the choice the vast majority of players would end up choosing the system that auto-forms groups for them and teleports them to the dungeon. They would, and they will, because it happened on retail, and it will happen again.
What you really want is convenience. What this is really about, is you wanting to turn classic into retail. That’s it. That’s what all of these convenience systems inevitably do. And you know that, and you’re still advocating for them anyway, which means you have no business playing classic, or making threads about it, and your opinion is invalid.
Go play retail - everything you want is already there.
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Everything has it good and bads. There is no such thing as “perfect”.
Exactly… it all comes down to our respective personal preferences.
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I agree 100%.
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Have my reluctant like. +1 to this.
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Well… yeah. It’s the same reason I use google instead of traipsing down to the library to look up something in an encyclopedia. You’re promoting tedium for tedium’s sake, and it’s never a good thing to do that.
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RDF doesn’t provide any convenience Group browser doesn’t already, it just allows more players to group together, more people to socialize with, which is what is contradictory of blizzard’s reason for removing the tool in the first place and replacing with a watered down retail LFG tool.
not having RDF in cata classic isn’t going to make it any better.
same features like Heroic+, retail LFG tool, arena rating rework, rewards for tanks/healers to run dungeons will do to the game. except RDF was actually in wotlk while their subscriptions were still growing to the peak. RDF didn’t ruin wotlk, and a single wotlk tool sure didn’t ruin a pile of poo expansion pack that followed it.
RDF is only going to allow players to run dungeons with more people, socialize with people they wouldn’t have if they were restricted to only their server’s group of players.
tell me how you really feel. make me stop playing classic how i want, do it tough guy.
i’m glad you feel that way, thank you for bumping the topic.
no i want to tank LFG dungeons for my baron rivendare mount and raid consumes. in classic.
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That’s probably why your education is lacking.
sick burn! you should really spend time away from the forums if you have to lash out at others with snarky remarks like that over their opinion.
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Its not about social experience. It is about drawing a line in the sand and pretending like they know best.
BFA they knew best. Shadowlands they knew best. But these things need to come in 3s. So we need another blown out example of them knowing best.
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lol they are going to find out real quick once cata classic happens if no other avenue of classic is available besides era
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RDF doesn’t provide any convenience Group browser doesn’t already, it just allows more players to group together, more people to socialize with, which is what is contradictory of blizzard’s reason for removing the tool in the first place and replacing with a watered down retail LFG tool.
Yes, it very obviously does provide more convenience than the current Group Finder tool does. Nothing about their reasoning is contradictory - you just don’t want to accept it.
not having RDF in cata classic isn’t going to make it any better.
Who said anything about cata? But I’m glad that you brought it up because Cata’s biggest problems were the content drought, the heroics that were too hard for the Wrath-babies, and the introduction of LFR, which meant that the entire game could be played by sitting AFK in a capital city waiting for your queue to pop. You didn’t go anywhere in the world because you didn’t need to.
You sat, in a city, AFK, waiting for your RDF or LFR queue to pop, and it was the most stultifying, boring, world-shrinking game environment that shredded the social fabric of the game from which it never recovered.
RDF was the first step in this process. And by the way, for the people bringing up the not having to queue at a Battlemaster for PvP thing - I don’t like this either, because it removed the social interaction you’d get from seeing and talking to other PvPers who were waiting at the Battlemaster. I met some great arena partners in original BC while waiting at the Battlemaster. It actually made it harder to find arena partners.
More convenient, yes, but also worse for the game, and the social dynamic of finding and interacting with other PvPers.
same features like Heroic+, retail LFG tool, arena rating rework, rewards for tanks/healers to run dungeons will do to the game. except RDF was actually in wotlk while their subscriptions were still growing to the peak. RDF didn’t ruin wotlk, and a single wotlk tool sure didn’t ruin a pile of poo expansion pack that followed it.
Where did I say RDF ruined WotLK? I didn’t - I think you’re getting a bit confused. But it was the first in a line of convenience systems that helped to destroy the social and travel aspects of the game, as I detailed above re Cata.
Also WotLK only grew by 0.5 million subs during the length of the expansion. By all accounts, based on the last two expansions, that was a failure. Subs peaked in Wrath, but Wrath introduced a host of systems that were the beginning of the end for retail. Everything that Wrath introduced to maximise convenience, limit travel, and completely casualise the game (this includes the faceroll heroics and mindless AoE raid trash and atrocious first raid tier) ended up killing it, and RDF is part of that.
RDF is only going to allow players to run dungeons with more people, socialize with people they wouldn’t have if they were restricted to only their server’s group of players.
The only advantage to RDF is helping people on low-pop servers find groups, I agree, but there’s no reason why the current Group Finder can’t be cross-realm, but it should still be limited to cross-realm with other low-pop servers, not every server. Whether you like it or not, the current Group Finder absolutely helps to create a sense of community with others on your server, and promotes a positive game environment because any ninjas or dickheads last 2 seconds in these groups.
I’ve grouped with many people I’ve seen running around levelling on my server, and have become friends with them, and will group for content with them at 70.
tell me how you really feel. make me stop playing classic how i want, do it tough guy.
Can’t help but feel if you’re advocating for these convenience systems that all helped to destroy the social and travelling fabric of retail then you have no business playing classic or advocating for these types of changes.
RDF, non-Battlemaster PvP queues and LFR all helped to shrink the world down to sitting AFK in a city waiting for a queue to pop, on repeat. It destroyed the game.
i’m glad you feel that way, thank you for bumping the topic.
I’m glad I get to respond to this topic 
no i want to tank LFG dungeons for my baron rivendare mount and raid consumes. in classic.
Which you can do very easily with Group Finder.
Blizz, put RDF or i just leave. Simple
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LFG is a dam joke to form groups lets be serious an honest its just crap… RDF is the answer and needs to be reinstated. Blizz has no real concept over what this game needs they just think they do. For ONCE listen to people gd.
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Even with the dumpster fire that is retail, I have 200% more faith in these devs to do something with WoW vs this community.