"RDF caused WoW to lose subs" argument

[Saralocks-thrall (Saralocks)]

@Elfz-westfall

Only blizz has the real info but we can speculate the data must be pretty convincing given their conviction.

You mean only sending out a survey to a few selected individuals then claiming that is the majority? Blizzard knows that the Boost is the most hated thing, yet, we still have that. So why disinclude RDF for?

[Urivial-grobbulus]

@Raharrak-darkspear

Firstly, Joyous Journeys, to my knowledge, may not be in the game come Lich King’s launch. The boosts, however, will remain in the game, likely until Cataclysm releases (if they choose to do this)

Yes, Joyous Journeys ends upon Wotlk Launch. Its still a feature that was put in the game right before a major expansion launch, at exactly the time when a majority of players were coming back to the game and would probably buy a boost if they were ever going to.

Blizzard off set this by bundling boosts into their not-an-expansion bundles so they could still re-sell wotlk to millions of returning players. That’s is what it is.

@Raharrak-darkspear

The number of allowed boosts is irrelevant - the fact that Blizzard is allowing for any player, at any time, to skip the majority of content contradicts any reason to not allow for RDF to be in for at least 1-70.

Not to mention, the boosting nerfs coming out right around the time they released their own boost.

RDF would be for leveling alts. That’s what you’re trying to say here, right? How the heck is the number of allowed boosts irrelevant to that? You can only pay for one lvl 70, full stop. If you want any more alts, you have to level them up.

The people who are willing to shell out money for the one single boost they’re allowed to buy in Classic would not be stopped from shelling out that money by RDF being added to the game. RDF =/= the complete skipping of 1-70 that buying a boost provides.

If Blizzard was offering unrestricted access to as many boosts as everyone could want, then I MIGHT be willing to entertain the argument that they’re not adding RDF specifically to sell more boosts.

But they’ve literally restricted the number of boosts possible in Classic Wotlk. The argument just flat out doesn’t make any sense.

[Elfz-westfall]

@Saralocks-thrall

Blizzard knows that the Boost is the most hated thing

You don’t know what the most hated thing is. Blizzard might. They made this choice so you’re probably wrong.

@Saralocks-thrall

why disinclude RDF

Probably because it was a terrible decision and they don’t want to repeat past mistakes.

[Saralocks-thrall (Saralocks)]

@Urivial-grobbulus

You can only pay for one lvl 70, full stop

Yes, per a “World of Warcraft” account, not a BNet Account. You do know there is a way to evade the system if there is money involved.

[Raharrak-darkspear]

@Urivial-grobbulus

How the heck is the number of allowed boosts irrelevant to that? You can only pay for one lvl 70, full stop.

Okay, I’ll try to break this down simpler for you.

• Blizzard states the community, and building relationships as one of their BIGGEST reasons to remove RDF from the game.
• Blizzard sells a level 70 boost, which effectively skips about 75% of content
• This means that a player can literally skip 75% of all team-building, relationship-building, community-building, etc., opportunities in the game.

@Urivial-grobbulus

The people who are willing to shell out money for the one single boost they’re allowed to buy in Classic would not be stopped from shelling out that money by RDF being added to the game.

This isn’t necessarily true either. For players on the lower-populated realms or factions, or players that have to play at 3am, they’ll feel more inclined to purchase a boost if RDF is NOT in the game because WITH RDF, they can still find groups.

@Urivial-grobbulus

But they’ve literally restricted the number of boosts possible in Classic Wotlk.

Again, if Blizzard is okay having players literally skip 75% of content with their boost, why are they against RDF for 1-70? RDF provides a LOT more socialization for 1-70 than boosting does.

[Saralocks-thrall (Saralocks)]

@Elfz-westfall

Probably because it was a terrible decision and they don’t want to repeat past mistakes.

And I see this all the time. What source do you actually have to say RDF is a mistake?

[Oriendaria-pagle]

Again, you are cherry picking what I said, So I’m going to quote me post, again.

@Oriendaria-pagle

That is literally the dumbest thing you came up with to make it seem like wrath is a bad game for not having RDF. That’s actually farthest from the truth, a lack of RDF does not affect me in the slightest. I just find it to be extremely beneficial to how I play, just like how LFG affects you.

The fact that you think, for some reason, that I think the game is unplayable is just laughable. But I express my concerns for the FUTURE of wraths life cycle because we will see the same thing, the SAME THING involving arbitrary gatekeeping from players like you to keep fresh/alts out of heroics or raids because they lack achievements. To me, that’s not a good thing or design for the game.

Everything you are saying is cherry picking my words to suit w/e BS narrative to twist it like I think wrath is garbage without RDF, it’s not, I just find, again, that feature to be extremely beneficial to my playstyle. But it also benefits other players, when it comes to making a new character as well as an alt to get caught up to the point of doing entry level end game for p1.

You are literally doing what I said, control. And self-inserting yourself for that.

[Urivial-grobbulus]

@Saralocks-thrall

Yes, per a “World of Warcraft” account, not a BNet Account.

Okay sure, but the number of people who are going to pay for 5-6 different WoW subscriptions in order to be able to boost 5-6 lvl 70s feels pretty small in the grand scheme of things. And those people going that far to skip to end game also probably weren’t that inclined to use RDF instead of just throwing money at the problem via boosting.

@Raharrak-darkspear

This isn’t necessarily true either. For players on the lower-populated realms or factions, or players that have to play at 3am, they’ll feel more inclined to purchase a boost if RDF is NOT in the game because WITH RDF, they can still find groups.

But they’ll still only be able to do that once. So for any other alts they want to make, they’ll have to level them.

@Raharrak-darkspear

Again, if Blizzard is okay having players literally skip 75% of content with their boost, why are they against RDF for 1-70? RDF provides a LOT more socialization for 1-70 than boosting does.

I don’t know why! That’s precisely what this conversation is about. I said I don’t know why Blizzard has chosen to keep out RDF. You’re convinced it’s because they want to sell more boosts. But if they want to sell more boosts, why are they restricting the number of boosts to 1 per account?!

My stance is that Boosts cannot be the reason Blizzard is refusing to put RDF in the game. There has to be other reasons for Blizzard to decide RDF is not a feature they want in Wotlk Classic. If Boosts were the only reason, they would let people buy as many Boosts as they want.

Make it make sense. Why does Blizzard not want to put RDF in Wotlk Classic? “To sell Boosts” is not a valid answer when they’ve gone out of their way to make it all but impossible to buy more than one boost.

[Elfz-westfall]

@Saralocks-thrall

What source do you actually have to say RDF is a mistake?

• Several people have expressed that sentiment
• I agree with that sentiment
• Blizzard, the only entity with the data to make an informed choice, didn’t add it to the game in spite of all the toxic noise

I was disappointed the first time it was added. I can’t believe they are actually re-creating the environment before this error.

[Elfz-westfall]

@Oriendaria-pagle

You are literally doing what I said, control. And self-inserting yourself for that.

Nope. I’m playing what they released and thankful they released it. The other stuff you invent isn’t real.

[Oriendaria-pagle]

That there is some God complex right there, and I suggest getting a shrink to help you.

[Raharrak-darkspear]

@Urivial-grobbulus

But they’ll still only be able to do that once. So for any other alts they want to make, they’ll have to level them.

THAT is the thing. Once a player boosts a character to level 70, chances are, they won’t need to worry about levelling up alts for a bit. Anyone levelling alts (or rather, trying to) when Wrath launches, for example, will be 100% S.O.L.

@Urivial-grobbulus

But if they want to sell more boosts, why are they restricting the number of boosts to 1 per account?!

Let’s look at this from a business perspective…

• Why not charge people an additional subscription fee for Classic?

Because if they did, much less players would be playing Classic, and then this revenue stream would negatively impacted.

• Why limit it to one boost per account?

There’s less time investment if players can boost multiple characters. Not to mention the amount of backlash that Blizzard would face in this case.

[Raharrak-darkspear]

@Elfz-westfall

Several people have expressed that sentiment

So… you’re mimicking what others say without any evidence? Gotcha!

[Elfz-westfall]

@Oriendaria-pagle

That there is some God complex right there, and I suggest getting a shrink to help you.

Every time I say I like the game you throw a hyperbolic fit. I need a shrink because I like the game?

…you’re silly and overly emotional.

[Elfz-westfall]

@Raharrak-darkspear

you’re mimicking what others say

No - I speak for myself.

[Raharrak-darkspear]

Clearly not when you can’t provide any evidence for literally anything you say apart from, “Other people feel this way.”

[Urivial-grobbulus]

My biggest problem with your whole argument is that I’m pretty sure most of the Pro RDF crowd wants RDF for max level random dungeons, not for leveling.

You’re literally the first Pro RDF person I’ve even come across who has talked about RDF being necessary for leveling, rather than people simply wanting RDF as a endgame service.

[Raharrak-darkspear]

@Urivial-grobbulus

I’m pretty sure most of the Pro RDF crowd wants RDF for max level random dungeons, not for leveling.

Perhaps you could show me some threads that mention it for endgame content, rather than levelling?

[Oriendaria-pagle]

Yeah, because you cherry pick my statements and change it up to suit w/e BS view that suits your needs and put what I said out of context. You’re a hypocrite and need to seek help. And the fact that you just happen to be this Delusional is just, wow.

[Elfz-westfall]

@Raharrak-darkspear

Clearly not

I got a little chuckle from that! Ha! You’re the arbiter of whether I speak for myself? That’s pretty arrogant but it actually made me laugh.