I don’t think it’s raid or die, but now there is better parity between M+ loot and raid loot with how the new loot tracks work and are awarded.
Herding cats, I mean managing a mythic raid guild is too much work not to incentivize better loot.
Raiders will gear faster on the high end than non-raiders now, but M+ will still have weekly access to myth track.
To me, the biggest change was crafted gear being 10 ilvl below myth’s end.
Can’t wait to see the threads of people complaining they can’t get into dungeon groups because they didn’t gear up through raiding.
Hardest content gives the best rewards. Shocking.
Please explain to me how someone doing a +15 or even higher is somehow easier content than someone killing the first raid boss on mythic? We can debate at what point mythic+ becomes harder than raid, but whether or not it surpasses it entirely is a conversation for maybe a kindergarten student.
You seem reasonably intelligent, but missing some context. You are thinking about what things will look like 2 or 3 months into the expansion. That’s not how mythic+ really works. Mythic+ players are going to be WAY behind people who raid mythic in regards to pushing keys. Mythic+ is absolutely about getting off to a very good start. The longer you are held back by gear, the harder it is to get score once you get the gear. And that’s just considering normal drops like armour and jewelry. Weapons and trinkets are going to be a disaster for mythic+ only players
All upgrades system have been mostly grinds, they are a way to extend the time it takes to fully gear yourself. Since we gear so fast this is a way to slow it down without affecting drops.
I was never fan of upgrade systems personally but this is where we at.
If you only kill the first boss on mythic, you are extremely limited in what gear you get.
Doing +15 or higher is irrelevant. Since doing a +8 got your mythic track loot.
Is your issue that you will not be one of the top key pushers in the world due to this change?
Like mentioned in the other thread, when the gap was smaller it let you “bring up” a lower difficulty item using higher difficulty crests.
Now it’s just a flat “you must grind crests to get back to how gearing mostly used to be” tax.
Interesting, given m+ and mythic open the same week
lmao
This got switched to +10 in TWW with latest post.
From the blue post yesterday it looks like they raised the key required for a mythic track vault item up to +10 (still way easier than doing the mythic raid of course).
enjoy your departure and take these Kleenex with you. I wouldn’t want you showing up with all that snot running down your face.
I was intentionally comparing current rewards.
8 or 10 is irrelevant within the context of m+ eventually getting harder than mythic raiding at specific breakpoints which are far beyond the reward line. The argument that m+ eventually gets harder is just irrelevant.
You will still be able to do this but further in a patch you’ll probably want a mythic track item. This isn’t “nerfing” heroic track gear but making your gear progression last longer.
So when Mythic raiding and Mythic+ come out at the same time, somehow the Mythic raider is already ahead?
As already mentioned, you get Mythic Track gear from vault at M+10 starting in TWW. Mythic+10 is easier to complete than a Mythic raid and both only get chance at loot once a week. (For arguments sake, its easier to find 5 skilled players to do M+10 than 20 skilled players to do a Mythic Raid)
So, what’s the issue here?
People sure do get all work up over Ilvls in this game. Like if I never plan on doing M+ or Mythic raids why the heck do I care if people that do have a higher Ilvl? … Oh look Raider Bob over there has better gear than me. What ever shall I do my world is totally ending. I might as well stop playing or something.
This is actually an incredible point I hadn’t considered.
I’ve read all your comments in this thread. I’m going to break it down for you. When we talk about raiders, we are talking about raiders who also do mythic+ versus mythic+ players that do not raid. Mythic+ is absolutely a competition, both by nature and design. But unlike something like a marathon, where you can make up for a slow start or even plan one, you absolutely have to get off to a good start. If you fall behind on gear, you fall behind on score. You fall behind on score, it is very difficult to catch up. Case in point, go run like a 15 on live servers right now or any season at this point. You will be playing with terrible players compared to the players that were pushing 15s in the first few weeks. I like to think that the cream eventually rises to the top, but unfortunately it doesn’t play out that way.
Just disable raiding gear outside of raids. That’s the raiders solution for whenever they have to be ahead, so make it a solution for them. Remember when raiders threw a fit PvPers can get good weapons early? When they complained about needing to M+ to raid?
Time for them to get a taste of their own medicine.
You still get mythic track rewards from vault with +9’s correct? How is this any different from what we have today?
You don’t need to keep up with the jones to functionally play the game.
Stop turning everything into a race and you will find that all of these problems go away.
That would be great, because at no point have you described a “raid or die” system.
You arent. You are specifically talking about Mythic Raiders who also participate in m+. Not “raiders”.
How is it a competition? Its a loot pinata.
No you dont.
Incorrect.
Have you ever ran a +15? Because it doesnt look like it.
So to recap, you arent really clearing anything up.