Dear Blizzard, it’s not their fault. When their mom’s were coaching them in soccer they didn’t keep score. A whole generation was told everyone is a winner, everyone gets a trophy. They don’t have the coping skills to handle losing.
Please create a new BG mode, remove all scoring, give the BG a set timer, when the timer runs out give everyone the exact same rewards. Call it “Battlefun” or something.
They’d just start complaining that the timer is too long.
While simultaneously complaining that the timer is too short.
Fairly sure if they made the game a big red button on the middle of the screen, that gave rewards every time you pressed it, someone would complain that you have to press the button.
They weren’t an issue in vanilla.
Imagine needing to stack a raid just to farm randoms and then attack people that have an issue with it. You folks are ruining the game for others.
They’re probably doing it or they’re just another “pvp happened” type of player.
Matchmaking would help, but any kind of MMR ruins the fun of BGS. I don’t want to deal with MMR when I’m trying to gear or playing a new toon.
Yea, a simple acknowledgement would put this to rest.
I don’t need to. The outcome suffices.
Nice false equivalency.
I’m not ignoring it. I have no issue with 5 mans. This has been repeatedly said.
Yea, that would be ideal, though I’d wager that’s what RBGs were meant to be. 
Appreciated
Exactly. It’s really that simple.
You expect to lose games in PVP, it’s part of the process. You also expect that when you queue for a random BG that you’re getting something resembling a fair match and that you have the same odds of winning as the other team.
You have no pretense of a fair game with decent odds of winning when one team has 5 bots and the other team has 15 people in a premade group.
New rules are needed when creative means are used to circumvent.
I expect people who have queued for PvP to at least try. To have at least some basic gear, at the very least, to have farmed enough honor before getting to level 70 to buy both trinkets.
But if I don’t always get what I expect, neither do you.
This is the WoW forums not purdue.edu
Lets investigate what you have stated clearly.
Nope.
Because one person with a good argument can be biased via sophistry.
Oh, match making should screen for gear in some capacity, but we’re talking about ‘fair’ in an environment where you’re trying to justify people exploiting the queue system to give themselves an inherently unfair advantage.
No one is exploiting the queue system…
It’s great when people default to “you’re using a logical fallacy.” Nobody in the real world, especially the forums, cares. Real-world arguments are won by any means necessary.
Yeah, gear imbalance is just as capable of deciding the match on its own.
How can you reasonably expect this in a system without any form of MMR?
I’m a healer main, so my perspective is somewhat different from most of the posters here too.
For me, it’s about the team I’m with, not about the one we’re destroying.
Someone with entry level PVP greens shouldn’t get paired against someone in full epics.
Yes they are. We know this because you can’t queue for epic BG’s as a raid. This isn’t complicated, your quote is out of context and was just pointing out that a couple people showing up in the same BG isn’t a reportable offense.
Indeed.
Trying to be bring in academic argumentation is a sign of ego to be honest.
Worse, if they switch between their alts to try to make it seem like they are being supported by others when it if in fact themselves just high fiving themselves.
The solution to fixing premades in BGs is a multi pronged approach where it requires staggered queues, delayed queues, and also dynamic and truly random matchmaking and brackets.
Gear is not MMR. It kind-of was in shadowlands, but not anymore.
I wasn’t talking about MMR, I was talking about gear.
MMR isn’t a great system but there’s just no way you can have a fair game when there’s a guy who can two or three tap a newbie before they’re even aware of what’s going on.
I’d say take it a step further. Even if it’s not fair, it’s random. Meaning you’re going to win some and lose some. The premades break that. You don’t have a chance of making up for the loss because the chances of being on the premade side are very slim.
They are exploiting the queue system.
If it was intended, they would have allowed raids to continue to que. The point the blue post makes is just queuing into someone, intentionally or not, isn’t breaking the rules. 8 groups all queueing isn’t the same as one group trying to queue into another.
how do you not know ?
how are you on this “main” mvp account all day but cant understand that the topic of this thread is referring to EPIC BGS and premades exploiting the q and dropping qs hurting the player experience for many pugs ?
like goodness .