Haste buff and cc immunity for landing kicks? 
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I am at a loss here…
This is called Juking, I don’t get how it is an accidental outplay…
precog is a bandaid fix to melee being able to get juked and still pseudo kick using the abundance of micro CC in the game
is the CC immunity too strong when it’s caster vs caster? i would say yes
zero sympathy for the average dh/war/dk/rogue who thinks it’s OP
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That’s exactly my point, yeah! With precog, that’s a strong play that almost certainly puts you in a good position. But without precog, what you did is just a larger misplay. Precog isn’t making that interaction more fair in any subtle way, it’s totally transforming what constitutes good or bad play
Crazy how like the reward for landing kicks is that you landed the ****ing kick.
Precog exists because the mind game between melee and casters is almost always a net loss for casters when it comes to juking. You guys don’t realize that as long as I have kick i’m in a position of power. Every global you spend juking and not getting kick out of the way is a lost global that you spent tanking damage and doing nothing.
Precog exists as a way to balance this war that is vastly in favor of melee.
Is precog being baseline and as powerful as it is, dumb? Perhaps. Maybe it needs to be reworked, maybe the haste shouldn’t be included.
But the meme that you need to be further rewarded by landing kicks outside of stopping said cast is hilarious
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So the new strat is to run in… get out of position… juke a kick… and now you have precog in the middle of the enemy team as a caster?
There are so many issues with this line of thinking in general not even being an argument against precog I don’t even know where to start tbh.
It’s really simple
If you juke a counterspell that would have been 5 seconds of interruption then your precog immunity is 5 seconds
If you juke a 2sec wind shear then your precog immunity also lasts 2 seconds
The bonus haste should be an honor talent or something it shouldn’t be baseline especially when casters are already naturally achieving 40% haste and the expansion just started
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I dunno what, or if, you’re asking here. Yes, you’ve summarized it correctly. Before precog, a fundamental part of caster gameplay was learning when it wasn’t worth trying to plant and cast. After precog, that situation is totally warped.
"Run in"isn’t it so much as “fail to run away”, also
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It’s still very bad to be out of position… Just fyi… precog did NOT change that. I would say if this is a struggling point for you, next time a caster is out of position, don’t get juked. Or even better just use a stun and zone their healer.
I dont think precog needs 5 secs. Nerf it to 3. And put an internal of 15. I think if we get it free this is reasonable
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I really like precog the way it is as an honor talent. Idk why they’re doing these changes
i’m not sure what i said that made you confident in this assumption. it can’t have been the spec i logged out in, it can’t be a pvp pedigree that you possess and i lack. if you don’t mind explaining that, i’d appreciate it.
that’s sometimes true, but gaining 6 seconds of infinite iframe with which to delay the enemy go is a huge swing. the misplay of allowing yourself to take up bad positioning while enemies move in, because you really wanted to wiggle your fingers on a few filler spells or some ccs nobody on your team bothered to set up, is obviated.
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Change > no change but i think this was poorly thought out.
Free extra honour talent for casters is the fine print here. Kinda strong to get both. It was a trade before.
I didnt actually read - is it a nerfed version of precog or full
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precog is fine the way it is, even if the new changes go live. you guys are overreacting. finally, we’ll be able to use another honor talent instead of having to pick precog. It should’ve been baseline to begin with.
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If a caster purposely puts himself at a disadvantage and runs into the middle of your team… way out of position(not a real strat, never seen this even used strat…). Don’t get super excited and try to kick him or even play the juke game… Just stun him and zone their healer and you win.
This isn’t an argument against precog, it’s just what to do in basic situations.
In a world where everyone has precog and most casters have multiple spell schools, a nerfed lockout simply isnt rewarding enough.
you’re absolutely right, but that isn’t what was originally under the microscope. this was:
this is all i originally set out to argue. that juking a kick is very, very often not a “complete outplay”.
The idea that you get a buff for locking people out would just lead to more bad melee kicking garbage schools for no reason other than to buff their zug leading to you ending games when they don’t have kick for something relevant.
This something you want?
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If it wasn’t a gear embellishment I think it’d be better. I’m already irritated with crafted gear especially when it comes to alts
Yeah. What part of that sounds bad to you? Bad plays are still punished and good plays are rewarded more.