Majority of players will only do AV for the rep grind, and rarely play it after that.
Even if you add the older style AV with tons of NPC’s, landmines, etc players will elect to rush style play the BG, they will even rush from objective to objective it basically becomes a race to which faction is faster and if premades are in the AV they usually just rush the end and tank everything.
I played on a server with this older style AV and this happened 90% of the time, and when turtles ( EPIC AV BATTLEZ ) happened most people complained and tried to get people to stop.
This is a thing of the past, you won’t get your 24 hour battles no matter how hard you cry.
if you’re going to quote you should quote more then 4 words so we know what context your talking about, its honestly hard to have any kind of discussion to what you replied for but I will try. in 1.5 you cant just zoom past everything with 40 people and kill the general, you would insta wipe easy. And i’ve played AV’s that last 20 min, not 4 hours, once people learn to zerg for rep then thats the only way you could go because thats the way the majority of players would so they dont miss out on the rep rewards.
as for holding choke points, you would have to have a set amount of people that hold the point, and hold it against 40 people which i guarantee most will get through
in 1.5 you wouldn’t have to convince people not to zerg, because they would try it a couple of times and die in the process.
its not that it would be unpopular, it would be second choice by far IF zerg fest AV was also in, people would run that and get rep maxed in order not to be left behind. you basically asking people to run 2 races, one race is 500 feet, and the other is 20 feet at the end you get 100 dollars. its not compareable because of the easy rewards.
in 1.12 - 2.2 and even into 2.3 somewhat, I never had an AV that was a zerg. It wasn’t until after reinforcements that “zerging” became a strategy on my battled group.
Also here is why your video doesn’t work as evidence. You want to claim that a premade can do it, so a pug team can zerg this exact same way. But then when I tell you a team could “zerg” 1.5, you all go "a pug isn’t going to be able to work together to “zerg” 1.5.
So you tell me a pug can do what I premade can do in 1.12 but can’t do what a premade could do in 1.5. You can’t have it both ways. Either pugs can pull off the same things as virtually impossible premades, or they can’t.
Why act like zerging was the complete totally 1000% accepted strat for AV, when I can tell you it wasn’t until after reinforcements?
I didn’t say “zoom by” I said “kill every NPC on the way to general they had to.” If you’re going to complain about not quoting more at least read what I said.
Im saying try it when classic comes out, ask for 1.5 or 1.5-1.12 and you can try it, like i said if people do like it they can change it after, no big deal.
I don’t know what this means. Who has said you can zerg 1.5 AV? There has not been a shred of evidence that is the case. Objectively it is much harder, from the massively buffed npcs and much more npcs. Someone posted a video from a private server. Actually, was that you? LOL. I think it was. Still trying to use private server as some kind of evidence? LOL.
Oh, the pieces are starting to fit together now. Man, I got baited hard. Moving on now.
the difference is the difficulty of 1.5, you HAD to cap towers, turn in scraps ect, you cant just fly across the map and go into the enemy bunker, the general alone was a hard mob to kill, you add captains, lieutenants, and other mobs, it would be a meat grinder. 1.5 is un-zergable
you’re missing the point entirely, AV Rewards where like raid tier level items, a group of people zerg like theres no tomorrow that gets max rep in a week or two… then can then go into any BG and SMASH! or they are already to do raids. easily people could be max geared in a matter of weeks rather then months like its supposed to take. It would be a major disadvantage for anyone and everyone playing classic
hell after a while they would get bored of BG’s and start ganking, and you try and stop someone in full AV pvp gear from ganking…
not to mention, people zerging just want rewards, not gameplay, they dont want AV, they want insta Im gud mode… lame!
I don’t know if it’s unzergable. Maybe a premade in amazing gear could pull it off. Possibly. But maybe not. The nerfs to the npcs between 1.5 and 1.12 are SUBSTANTIAL. So right away it’s incredibly more difficult to pull it off. The bosses themselves are 30% more powerful. That’s a huge amount. Then you add in guard npcs that themselves are extremely powerful.
But I don’t understand the argument that if you can zerg 1.12 AV you can also zerg 1.5-1.7 AV. That statement is just silly. They’re radically different. I don’t know what comparison Dawn is trying to make by saying if a pug can do one, then they can do the other. That’s like saying if a pug can do an lfr raid, then obviously they can also do a Mythic raid. It doesn’t make any sense.
Your greatly over stating the value of the rep rewards most of the BG’s had 1 maybe 2 rewards that were actually worth getting.
And second once again, so what? The people who want the AV gear would run the 1.12 version until they get what they want then quit, if it’s as easy you’re making it out to be it shouldn’t be that much of an issue for people who prefer 1.5 to do it either.
And to your point why do you want to play with people who just want rewards to begin. Offering both versions would guarantee that the people in 1.5 are people who as you say actually care about the gameplay.
I dont think you actually read my posts… these rewards aren’t some regular BoE green, they’re blues and purples, these items are raid level items (no not fully raid gear ready)
use the race metaphor again… one race is 500 meters, lets add hurdles, and the other race is 20 meters, once you win 12 times you get a jetpack. obviously people are going to get that jetpack faster that run the 20 meter race… now they put that jetpack on and fly through the 500 meter race winning every, single, time…
and what your saying is its totally fair for people to do that, how can you not understand the hypocrisy?
people would blast through 1.12 and get the rewards, then jump into 1.5 and wreck people with an unfair advantage…
if you can’t understand that, then you must be a troll, because that’s as cut and dry as you can get.
Oh no i understand your point. You’re not understanding mine, 1.5 AV wouldn’t be there for the gear, it would be there for the gameplay. If the people who want 1.5 AV are that worried about gear they could do 1.12 get the gear and then never bother with it again.
The only “evidence” against “You can’t zerg 1.5 AV”, is that it never happened in the 1 month that 1.5 existed."
The difference in difficulty is kind of irrelevant as no matter how strong the NPCs are they aren’t going to stand up to the whole 40 person team are they? Or are they so strong that even a 40 man team can’t beat them? In which case no wonder AVs lasted for weeks on end, no one could ever win 1.5 AV so it had to be nerfed.
You all keep thinking by zerging I mean rushing past all the NPCs. No, “the zerg rush” is not just about running past the NPCs. It’s about rushing into the enemies base and killing everything. In the case of AV, killing every NPC and tower/bunker on the way to the general.
The exact AV choice isn’t a deal breaker for me. It might be nice for the majority of players to be able to see (for the first time) some components of AV that were exclusive to early WoW. Might pique curiosity and get more people to check out the game.