You are missing the point. The fact that horde are closer to anything at all out of the gate is a massive advantage. Massive!
Itâs cool to see the same conversation happening that already came and went 12 years ago. Blizzard didnât listen or care back then (when the company was actually good) and they certainly wonât do anything about it now.
Indeed, the recent changes made it clear blizzardâs priority is for horde to win AV not for it to be balanced.
Hasnât boycotts worked in the past? Just donât queue for it like I am doing and maybe Blizzard will do something. Prob not since they donât want to spend any money on Classic since it may hurt there earnings and canât get those shareholders upset with you.
If it gets 10x more alliance to queue AV then please do it.
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The distance between spawn points and objectives is NOT based on PVE. It shows how quickly Alliance and Horde can reinforce various areas of the map, which is a massive factor in winning PVP encounters on the map and successfully attacking or defending objectives.
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If you really want to prove a point, swap the sides. Alliance start with the Frostwolves and Horde start with the Stormpikes. Keep the NPCs in their respective areas (Alliance now are aligned with Drekâthar and Horde with Vanndar). It will never happen, but it would be hilarious to see how previous map (more than just terrain) imbalances may actually have made an impact. 
If they do this, Horde will still win every game, but Allies will pretend like they always knew North side had the advantage, but it doesnât matter as much as OP HORDE RACIALS which make them win EVERY GAME.
Sorry, this stuff is too predictable.
The problem is people want to blame something other than themselves.
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Good then they should do it. Seems like if you feel making it fair wouldnât accomplish anything that thereâs no harm in it
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Generally, Iâm an advocate for complete removal of racial abilities. The fact that they were not mirrored was cause for instantaneous imbalance. Your arrogance that Horde would win every game is interesting. Generally, Iâve met the same caliber of players on both sides.
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Iâve been asking for Blizzard to change the starting point on the maps for 15 years. I have multiple posts asking them to do so recently.
The funny part is almost no Alliance are asking for this. Instead, they want to ânerfâ the South side starting point. Pretty telling.
If you think youâre at a disadvantage the first thing you should ask for is to switch sides.
So is moving Horde cave going to magically make all the Alliance AFKers no longer exist?
Letâs move that cave Blizzard! Better yet, letâs reverse the map! Pretty sure it will not matter as long as the Alliance âalways have 15-20 AFKâŚâ
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We should all want this
Alliance should 100% boycott AV and push the horde queues high enough to get them on board.
Even the match and from there whoever wins did so because they were better. WSG gets a ton fewer complaints because outside of a few minor things itâs pretty much a mirror map
Many Alliance donât want it because theyâre smart enough to know the History of AV and know that this exact version of the map is heavily Alliance favored, to a degree that HORDE Boycotted the map in Vanilla.
The smart players know that changing the sides on the map is the worst thing that can happen to Alliance.
Thatâs why they cry for nerfs to South side instead. Itâs not about âbalanceâ for Allies itâs about feeling like they got their entitled number of wins.
Itâs controlling IBGY for alliance to win and SHGY for the horde. The horde cave is closer to IBGY than SPGY to SHGY. You notice the difference of distance between the two.
I been in a 20+ alliance defending IBGY and we slowly lose it. We canât get reinforcement fast enough.
I believe the cave has a rezz timer of 20 people spawning and the graveyard is at 10.
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I think the Hopping up the back of Dun Baldar is far greater an issue!
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this would be true if it was 2006⌠ally players sucked back then, but everyone is competitive now
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AFKâing/leeching wonât go away on either side no matter what, but I think itâs made much worse by the general sense among a lot of Alliance that âwell, itâs a loss even if I try, so why tryâ. I think if the map was more balanced and people felt like they had a real shot to win theyâd afk/leech less. One thing I notice is that AFK/leeching increases after Horde takes SHGY. So the first engage might have ~35-37 (granted sometimes itâll be more like 30 but not that often) but once SHGY is gone people get the sense that the game is effectively over and stop really fighting. In games that are closer, where Alliance has an established offense, I donât see as many people dropping out.
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You know, I believe this is the third time Iâve seen you state that you could write volumes about how tilted the map is for alliance, and yet in none of your replies have you listed a single thing as an example. Not oneâŚ
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Heâll just say âThE aLlIaNcE cAn HoLd ThE dB bRiDgE tO wIn ThE gAmEâ