You can have ML back When I get flying at max level day one back.
Slavery definition
a condition of having to work very hard without proper remuneration or appreciation.
Making people work for 9 hours each week without any items is pretty much slavery
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I’d like to have both!
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If you’re going to just assert that Blizzard openly lies about its reason for changes, then there’s no hope of presenting evidence you would ever accept as valid. I think that’s called a witch hunt–you seek support your own narrative to the exclusion of available facts and logical conclusions.
For those with some modicum of rationale thought…
The Game Director said in a Q&A that removing ML in favor of personal lloot was about having “more control, as an individual, over your fate. … What group & master loot mean for many people is that their rewards are at the mercy of others in ways that often AREN’T FAIR.” See this post and the video time-mark referenced there.
P.S. I would be in favor of ML being allowed for 100% guild groups in Mythic Raid. I also think item-level is a bad “trading restriction,” but I don’t see how they can do better since they clearly can’t balance the power of secondary stats and sockets. At least war/titan-forging is gone! 
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Zeno, your problem is that you’re looking at this entirely from a selfish point of view, and that’s not what progression raiding is about.
I go weeks without getting any gear. So do most raiders. That’s how raiding is.
When gear that’s useful DOES drop, the best thing for the guild is to give it to the people who get the most out of it.
I got a trinket off Lady Ashvane (Mythic) that I never used, but it was BiS for a third of the DPS in the raid. But I couldn’t give it to them because of the personal loot restrictions.
And then, because of how awful warforging/titanforging was, I couldn’t give away the 2nd copy of that trinket (because it was warforged) or the third (because it was titanforged).
The sales pitch is “personal loot is yours to do with as you wish” except that’s a lie because of the stupid trading restrictions.
Anyway, raiding isn’t about WHAT ABOUT ME WHAT DO I GET WHAT’S IN IT FOR ME like your attitude seems to be. It’s about what’s best for the team and the guild’s progression as a whole. And that’s something that people who DON’T do progression raiding will just never understand.
Thank you Vortimer my fellow Paladin. I was beginning to feel cornered and you rushed to my aid.
Guilds have still cleared the raid this tier.
If PL was that bad then progression wouldn’t be there but, guilds seem to be doing fine.
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Ion is a proven liar, though. He swore up and down back in Legion when they introduced scaling that mobs would never scale based on an individual player’s item level.
Then some people did an easy experiment where they took off a couple pieces of gear, and watched as mob health pools instantly changed around them.
So then Ion had to admit, yeah, mob levels actually DO change based on an individual’s item level. He was just lying when he claimed they didn’t.
Source ?
Lots of characters
Dude, I’m not here as a crutch for your lack of knowledge. It was back when the Broken Shore patch released. Go dig it up if you want to read it so badly.
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My experience at identifying contradictions from forum posters is vast.
By your own account, you have proven that you don’t NEED it… you just want it, despite already being successful without it.
None of this matters though, because it’s likely that the only way it’s ever coming back is if Blizzard bean counters believe that having it return would be a net gain to revenue. Since this issue only affects a very small amount of players, I would not gamble on that happening.
If it DOES come back, then the Blizzard of recent years will be likely to monkey with it (as they tend to do).
At the least, they would probably decrease drop rates in ML dungeons to make it just as effective (time-wise) to use either method. Or they could get weird and put in something to protect recruits… like keeping recruits on PL for 60 days after joining the guild.
The possible iteration possibilities boggle the mind.
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Nah personal loot is so much better. Master loot should be an option for guilds though, but never in pugs or lfr. Plus if I get a drop in a pug that’s not an upgrade for me, but I want to keep it for mog or de there’s nothing wrong with that. I’m the one that got the drop.
Yup you convinced me.
with master loot being gone wow sub numbers have gone up.
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Actually they’ve gone down. But whatever.
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Nope look it up.
I already gave an example on why it’s needed. Not even gonna bother reading the rest of your nonsense.
Man, I feel like I should be on horde with this thread.
That’s how it was in Legion. But people still came to the forums in Legion posting their horror stories about pugs using master loot - which was actually impossible. And people would keep saying “you can’t even do that, you’re just lying” but lying is something people love to do on the WoW forums so it just continued nonstop.
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Is this another trials not getting loot through Master Loot isn’t stealing thread?
lmao Master Thief can stay gone.
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ML will never come back. It is gone because it was abused. Instead of trying to bring it back so that you can abuse it more, push for PL restrictions to be removed.
Guild groups that ALL agree to funnel loot can do so. Members who don’t want to be forced to do a bunch of work, week after week, to gear up a “core” group can keep their loot.
For those who say that progression raiding is all about “what is best for the raid”… explain what happens when a “standard” raider continually has to give up their loot for the “core” for several weeks, ends up underperforming solely because of the lack of gear, and someone of the same class applies to the guild with better gear / parses? That “standard” member gets screwed and just wasted several weeks of hard work just to get the finger.
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