So maybe raid loot acquisition needs to be looked at. Its already pitifully low.
Or raid poaching like before. Guild struggling to get 20 bodies, recruits someone, gear them with the heroic raid you already have on farm, just to see leave for a better progressed mythic guild. GG.
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I’m going by what you provided, I am not in the practice of doing the leg work to figure out what you are saying.
well that is 1 solution. the only problem with that is that your easiest mythic boss is usually 10x harder than the lowest keystone that drops the highest possible loot.
so the whole gearing system will have to be revamped. or separate them.
I dont think the entire gearing system needs to be revamped. Or separated.
Start with doubling or tripling loot. Remove the “rare item” tag on trinkets. Bring back a form of the dinar system for deterministic upgrades. Go from there.
Separating them will just tell people to stay in their lanes, make catching up harder, make people less likely to branch out.
I’d rather focus be on making raiding more rewarding.
Then that’s just bad game design and needs to be reworked. Anything deemed as the meta to upgrades but is unfair in it’s application should be scrutinized and reworked otherwise the game will die because people will lose faith in the system and stop playing. Not everyone wants to re-roll to a shaman to enjoy the game.
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Any combo of specs can get the top gear from m+. Only when you get much higher is it beneficial or even required to go meta to compete, but that would be true with even tiny differences in dps.
I disagree.
How do you “rework” infinite scaling?
But how do you fix that?
The issue is the more challenging things get, the more picky people will be. The best you can shoot for is making sure all specs can comfortably get the top rewards. Which you absolutely can.
If you are pushing past 12s for clout, then yes. A meta will exist. There is no way around it.
Well there is. But the way around it is to make everything so trivial it doesnt matter. Which is the wrong choice.
you got alot of participation trophys growing up didnt you? if you let the meta hurt your gameplay thats on you. i just play what ever i want and go from there. sometimes its meta sometimes its not.
This is a balanced, fair and common sense perception of what WoW should and could be… How dare you!
i have no problem with blizzard doing that to raid loot. the problem arises around the fact that what? 95% to 99% of guilds will never see beyond 40-50% of a mythic raid clear, yet those same players can run in and wipe out a load of +10’s in a few hours.
if separating the gearing paths is not an option, then revamping raid loot would have to be the only option. and it would have to work where players get tokens rather than actual drops or something? cause killing a mythic raid boss could take weeks @ 3-6 hours per week vs getting unlimited loot in m+. i dunno but something do have to change.
i never ever felt that m+ was the problem. its just that having to spend time in m+ for raid progression gear just felt redundant. it in a way also made raiding feel pointless. you dont need gear anymore, just achievement kills.
Short of removing raid lockout, I don’t think it’s ever gonna be balanced because no lockout is always gonna be better short term. And there’s absolutely no way to put a lockout on m+ as it is now.
I don’t see any problem with this at all. Why should raiding be the only path to the best loot in the game?
By not making it infinite scaling. Just cap it. Make the last level very difficult but doable by every class and spec and then tone the difficulty down from there. At a certain point infinite scaling is not infinite because players are going to hit an ilvl cap anyways and then be capped by that. What’s the point of infnite?
I’m sure at least 1 person has asked for every form of content to be removed/discontinued in WoW.
There are many threads asking for LFR, M+ or delves to be removed, but it trickles down to people asking for super casual things like pet battles and pet battle dungeons to be put on the chopping block. What did pet battles do to you?
No matter what content Blizzard makes, someone will be unhappy and demand it be removed even if it doesn’t impact them.
If WoW was a room of 1 color tone, someone would probably ask for a room of darkness and if it was a room of darkness, someone would probably prefer non existence, haha.
I dont know what the best solution to this is. If you can get fully geared in the first 4-5 bosses, then why would you need the following.
This is where I would think something like a dinar system would help. You can slowly get some slots to fill in the missing holes.
I get that. Which is why solutions I try to find are more focused on making raiding more appealing, than taking away m+ loot.
Like. I am ok with a person who raids and m+ getting geared up faster than a person that only does one. My issue is a person that only raids falls behind a person that only m+s. So I would like raid gear specifically looked at.
But its content that does not offer any rewards. Its just to push yourself. See what you can accomplish.
Everyone can already comfortably accomplish the highest gear rewards.
The point of infinite is that the wall is different for different people.
“I cant get into 15s, therefor no one should be allowed to do 15s” is not the right answer.
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i agree on that front. but at the same time with m+, we dont progress our key for failure, but we still get the loot.
raids need to be look at in a similar way. time is money so to speak.
spending 100-200 wipes on a boss over the course of 2-3-4 weeks and not being rewarded for time and effort even like how m+ rewards for failure in a sense due to timers etc… just feels bad.
i understand why m+ players hate raiding, but i also understand why raiders hate feeling forced into m+.
there are solutions, i am sure of it. but blizzard needs to step up and do something.
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Keys are one of the most successful and popular things in the game everywhere except gd they aren’t going anywhere dw about it
My stance on it is that while I may have preferred that they went a different route than M+ to begin with, it’s here, been here longer than some of the people who complain about it.
So it should stay and other things can be added. Instead of asking for things you don’t like to be removed people should ask for things they do like to be added. If you just want things removed because other people enjoy them then you shouldn’t be listened to.
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that would probably be the best solution. that and increased boss drops.
also m+ can reward you with a mythic item from any dungeon even if you didnt complete that dungeon yet.
raid vault should work the same way while were at it. if your guild only got down 1 mythic boss then you should be eligible to get something in your vault from any boss and not just the 1 you killed.
that would be another great improvement.